• THE PHOENIX PROJECT FROM

    From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Saturday, June 20, 2026 06:11:00
    Filename: Phoenix1.Thd
    Type : Message Thread
    Author : Various/Compiled by Ed Stewart
    Edited : Dan Brown
    Date : 08/08/92 (received)
    Desc. : Message thread about the Phoenix Project from a GEnie Forum



    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    P. MIDDLER [Paul]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    So far, the Phoenix Project has released three reports:

    * The Dulce Report (Summary file: DULCEDOC.ZIP)
    An extensive study of an area that was claimed to have an
    underground U.S./Alien base.

    * The Ultimate Secret (Summary file: ULTSEC.TXT)
    The Majority Agency for Joint Intelligence (MAJI) The Secret

    War Against The Aliens Star Wars (SDI) Exposed

    * K-2 -- A Secret California Alien Base (Summary file: K2RPT.TXT)
    Their discovery of an underground Alien base at Pilot Peak,

    Plumas County, California.

    More are expected to be released in mid-to-late August.

    The following is a message I discovered on Fido:UFO from Jack
    Mathias, Phoenix Project Spokesperson, addressed to All:

    As stated in the beginning of each of our reports, [excluding
    ULTSEC.TXT] the Phoenix Project is a private, civilian, research
    organization without any official affiliation to any branch of the
    United States government. It came into existence by chance in 1952 when
    a group of "buddies" met and discussed their ideas. Even back in the
    early days of the UFO flap it was becoming obvious that the truth was
    not being released. Because of this the Phoenix Project started. As did
    the other organizations. However, unlike these others, we remained in
    the shadows, never releasing any information until it was felt the time
    had arrived. That time has come.

    The Phoenix Project has never and does not seek publicity. And, for
    obvious reasons. We also value what every other person does; security
    and safety. It is because of this that there is not much more that we
    can say regarding our organization.

    One of our investigators became involved in the UFO cover-up during
    the Mantell incident of 1948 and later became a special investigator
    with Project Blue Book until 1952. Two investigators were
    members of the Air Force and three were Navy. Each of these people,
    was, at one time or another, either attached to or connected with the
    intelligence edifice. However, remaining in the shadows mandates
    that the organizations, divisions, etc., not be disclosed. It
    is through these activities and/or contacts made during the time of
    military involvement that the team has been able to obtain much of our
    information. These contacts are loyal and trusted personal friends who
    we have known for more than twenty years and since every bit of
    information supplied by these people has checked out, we firmly
    believe that we have not been suppliedany disinformation.

    Because of our past intelligence backgrounds and to protect this on
    going relationship with these contacts, revealing our true identity
    could jeopardize the personal safety of ourselves, our
    families and theirs as well. We have all witnessed examples of
    "termination with extreme prejudice," a phrase whose meaning is well
    known within the intelligence community.

    ..............

    Jack Mathias believes people have a reason to doubt the Phoenix
    Project findings, since their identities will remain secret. He did
    think Paranet jumped to conclusions about the Dulce and K-2 reports.
    Jack recommends getting the reports for reference and go check them
    out.

    I cannot think of a good reason why the Phoenix Project would be a
    hoax. The reports cost between $10.00 and $12.50, so they are not
    making much money from this.

    If there are some questions about the Phoenix Project and I don't
    have the answer, I could forward them to Jack Mathias to see what he
    says.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    M. MASTALER [Mike]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Paul.... thanks for starting this topic. I just got information of
    their reports, and as you said , they are quite reasonable. Here are
    some more reports they say will be ready Aug 30, 1992:

    K-2 supplemental report.
    The NASA presence at Quincy
    The Area 51 report
    The Joint US/Alien research base # 920815 $10

    (opps,that K-2 report # is 920820 $10 )

    The"icecaves" report
    The Los Alamos US/Alien base # 920830 $12.50

    Advent Publishing Company
    PO box 3748
    Carson City NV. 89702
    Send them a S.A.S.E. to get a complete list of their reports.

    Mike

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    E. STEWART8:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------


    I am somewhat puzzled by these folks that call themselves the Phoenix
    Project. They say they are tight personal friends of each other and
    first organized themselves in 1952 after having shared careers together
    in military intelligence.

    Well, that means they have known each other for at least forty years
    and not twenty. Also, that should put them around seventy to eighty
    years old. Somehow, I am having a hard time visualing these folks
    scurrying around the Plumas National Forest gathering evidence
    incognito. It is tough enough for a young hiker to trek through that
    country, much less a setpuagenarian.

    But, I guess we will never know since they feel their true identities
    must remain secret.

    Ed

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Name Not Present in Header
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A joint US/Alien reserach base?! Into what are they doing research?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    GDW. SUPPORT:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Orbital mind control lasers?

    Some of the guys must be a least 60, but there might have been some
    `additions' later on. From looking at the files, one can see that they
    must of had help with the magnetic survey, since I doubt that military
    intelligence personnel are familiar with using such equipment. As far
    as age goes, they may have had help from family and friends. I had
    received the same type of listing as Mike did, but I found out that
    people who received their lists just a week ago had a slightly
    different list. The differences included a July 30th date (instead of
    Aug 30th) and another report called K-3 -- A Secret Alien Base used for
    Controlled Humans. For some reason, they had to delay the reports by
    one month. I'm still not sure if they are for real, but I don't
    understand why anyone would go through such trouble to perpetrate a
    hoax. I heard that their logo is not a registered trademark, as the
    files suggest, but the source of the info is exceedingly unreliable.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    P. MIDDLER [Paul]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Well, Jack Mathias hasn't been on FidoNet for a couple of days which
    suggests he is either on a field trip or he is trying to lay low for
    awhile. Maybe his `group' doesn't like him to leak information, or
    someone is getting close to figuring out that it's one big hoax.

    The heliport near Quincy belongs to the forest service and there is a
    NASA facility along the restricted road that leads to the heliport. At
    night, the NASA people shine a green beam into the sky. Their
    experiments are either related to earthquake monitoring or atmospheric
    monitoring. The Phoenix Project is creating a report on NASA's presence
    there.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    M. MASTALER [Mike]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Keep it comin' Paul !!

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    G. COX11 [GARY]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Paul

    You've tricked me again - first time I've been online "live" in
    sometime - surprised to see this topic. Someone just dumped me a copy
    of the k-2 report today - I haven't had time to read it yet. My off the
    cuff comment is that no one - I mean that - could find a superbly
    hidden underground base of unknown size with only a general idea of the
    location. What would be found - is a series of anolamous readings and
    findings and it would cost a small fortune to determine the true source
    of these readings. And this includes a fullscale survey by leading
    professionals using the very best equipment that exists.

    So it would be hard to prove or disprove anything of this nature
    without a lot more cash that the total sum of ufo enthusiasts could
    raise. I will get back here after I read k-2...

    I should would appreciate it if someone could tell me how to subscribe
    to this good stuff off of internet? The copy I have originated out of
    Pro-Net Australia Board...

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    P. MIDDLER [Paul]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Gary,

    The Phoenix Project claims to have access to all the expensive
    equipment necessary to do the survey. Since Phoenix is a secretive
    organization, one cannot be sure if they have or don't have access to
    specialized equipment.

    Someone on FidoNet:UFO is planning to get some of his prospecting
    buddies together (one works just 10 miles from K-2) and they will do a
    magnetometer survey to check the Phoenix Project's findings.

    Why do you have to get your material from Australia? I got the
    material from FidoNet:UFO and Compuserve. Jack Mathias, the Phoenix
    Project Spokesman, places the reports on both of these nets. From there
    it eventually ends up in Australia. I'm not familiar with Internet, but
    if you get on a BBS that has it, they probably have hefty useage
    charges. There's a BBS called NetCom and they have
    UseNet's:alt.alien.visitor . I haven't called them, but the phone no.
    is 408-241-9760 and type "Guest". BUT you'll probably get big long
    distance bills and they probably charge for access to their BBS. The
    important posts that come from there are often reposted on Fido:UFO, so
    you might look for a local BBS that has it.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    P. MIDDLER [Paul]: (Forwarded Message By Mike Corbin)
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    ParaNet UFO Echo#1726

    Dt: 07-26-92 23:56
    By: Paranet(sm) Information Service
    To: All
    Re: Strong Word Of Caution!

    Over the last few days we have been posting information supplied by the
    Phoenix Project of Carson City, Nevada. This information has been
    strongly disclaimed by ParaNet pending the results of our investigation
    to determine the validity of the Phoenix Project and its officers.

    While the investigation is still ongoing, we have found some highly
    disturbing things relating to credibility of the group. This
    information will be reported as soon as the investigation is completed.
    This should be in the next few days.

    Until this investigation is complete and the findings published,
    ParaNet wishes to urge everyone not to send any money to the group.

    Michael Corbin
    Director

    --- FD 1.99c
    * Origin: ParaNet -- Leading UFO Research Network (1:104/428.0)

    [Well, It's been a week since that was posted and so far they have not
    reported on their findings. Shortly after this message was posted,
    Michael Corbin sent a message to Jack Mathias, telling him to reveal
    the names of the Phoenix Project members. ParaNet may just be blowing
    smoke. They are trying to set-up an atmosphere in which it is necessary
    for them to reveal their identity. They should have already posted the
    disturbing information if they had any. Otherwise all they have is
    probably a bunch of rumors.]

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    G. COX11 [Gary]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Paul et al

    I've spent some going over the K2 report here and have some general
    observations to make.

    An uncanny absence of sounds in a wilderness area is hardly unusual -
    it would be normal for the local fauna to shut down due to the
    intrusion of humans into their turf.

    The feeling of being watched is hardly unusual - it occurrs frequently
    with city slicker types who feel paranoid without throbbing masses of
    humanity surrounding them. Further in sensitive individuals with a
    great deal of experience in this phenomena - it can be a very reliable
    guage.

    The reaction of the local rangers was typical in all respects.

    It's not unusual for any area to be non-radar observed - large areas of
    the US are void of radar coverage.

    The initial tale of the discovery of the K2 site via triangulation of
    transmitted signals is a little flakey - someone just happens to hear
    an unusual transmission and keeps monitoring it - with SW there are
    many such transmissions.

    The closed mouthed loggers - this is common in an industry under attack
    by greens, etc. Samething for the road improvements coinciding with new
    logging in the area.

    A magnetometer is old technology at best - the portable kind aren't as
    fine tuned and data productive as the report stated. A computer
    generated frequency density map of the survey - which I didn't get a
    copy of - would be of interest. My interest would be seeing if the
    survey produced any unnatural geometry.

    Since a mag was used - the formation must be fairly shallow - if so a
    portable core drill could be used to sample the formation. If I was
    directing the mag team - I would ask for a comparative survey in an
    adjacent area to determine if either was anomalous to the area. A third
    survey would be fairly conclusive.

    Further a professional look at the area would include a fresh aerial
    survey - with aerial stereo pix used to generate an AutoCad map of the
    site. The next step would be a real look underground with GPR ground
    penetrating radar and using an AutoLISP/AutoCad program to produce a 3-
    d map. After looking at the results I could decide whether it would be
    worth sinking a drill bit in for a log or coring, etc.

    Interestingly enough - Phoenix's initial contact was Dr. Peter Sturrock
    at SRI...GPR was developed by Dr.Lambert Dolphin at SRI. If NASA truly
    shows an interest in K2 - it would be a serious give away if they were
    doing aerial photography and toting around some GPR equipment. Further
    it might serve someones purpose to fabricate this data and activity at
    K2 and wait and see who shows up. If the feds showed a serious interest
    it would tend to promote the alien connection whether the site is
    authentic or not...The most curious part of the report was the pond -
    was this a beaver dam?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    P. MIDDLER [Paul]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Gary,

    I always feel like someone is watching me.<g> You said a number of
    things, so I will respond to your message next time since I am tired.
    In the mean time, I stole this message off a Net to show that a group
    of people are making an effort to check out K-2.

    * Forwarded from "FidoNet UFO Echo"
    * Originally from Steve Jones
    * Originally to Warren York
    * Originally dated 08-01-92, 7:56

    [From ] Steve Jones
    [To ] Warren York
    [Date ] 01 Aug 92 07:56:02
    [Subject ] Re: Phoenix project

    Greetings Warren- I am not surprised about Thunder, Inc. Jack Mathias
    just left me a post that the address for the company puts inside the
    base boundaries for Kirkland. So much for that contact, but purhaps he
    still might be contacted just for drill.

    As I told Jack, even though I'm not from the state (Missouri I think)
    I am very much of a "show me" person, and as such, I am still not 100%
    convinced about Dulce. He respects that, which to me is a good sign.

    I have receved the K2 report and it is most interesting. There are
    several pages of X, Y coordinate data from the magnetometer, pictures
    of the site and specific locations of the cavern outlets, a blown up
    version of the topo map of the location (Bluenose Mountain Quadrangle-
    7.5 minute series), a map showing the radar zone coverage for that area
    (including the dead spots). These guys are definitely no into this for
    the profit. If I were making this packet available, the cost of $12.50
    would just about cover my expenses. The audio tape of the original
    transmissions that keyed these guys to that location are indeed
    strange. They are heavily modulated and overlayed with what sound like
    synthesizer signatures of a random sort. I strongly suspect that once
    these are lifted, the data tracks can be located. I can see why the
    guys at Stanford and at Ames didn't want anything to do with the tapes.
    anyone with sound engineering background should have a crack at this
    tape. I am looking into that.

    I have a group that is going to be doing a long term observation of
    the site and I am looking for qualified volunteers. This site
    observation will be from August 5 through the end of the month if
    possible. It may be shorter due to lack of manpower. This is strictly a
    scientific observation expedition and as such there will be absolutely
    no hostile intents. From what the report has stated (they did have a
    CE4 incident) the greys are just as curious about us as we are about
    them and respect those with non-hostile intents. Anyone who is
    interested should be over 18 years of age and be prepared for some
    possible heavy duty mental activity (as in grilling by the locals and
    the government people up there- and according to what I've heard there
    may be lots of them). Those interested should leave e-mail for either
    myseld or Dan Brown, my co-moderator (of the Sacramento UFO SIG). I am
    looking into the possiblity of some anthro graduate students coming
    with us. Everyone will be briefed before leaving.

    As I am sure that you are aware, I suspect that this transmission is
    monitored and I have no discomfort with the idea that they probably
    know that we are coming (the government). That is why I am making this
    as public as possible. They hate publicity. Even before this post, over
    50 friends of mine are fully aware of were I'm going and why.
    Warren, I have communicated with you several times over the past two
    years and respect you positions. Keep me posted.

    TTYL....Steve Jones (co-moderator of the Sacramento UFO Group)

    --- FMail 0.90
    * Origin: Gates Of Delirium (916)446-7286: (1:203/163)

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    G. COX11 [GARY]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thanx Paul - I know what you mean!(g)

    What have you heard about the Dulce location? Both the Phoenix reports
    were real mind blowers. With a large group of observers at the K2 -
    there should be some very interesting stuff coming out fairly
    soon...keep up with great info...

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    P. MIDDLER [Paul]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Gary,

    I haven't heard anything further about ParaNet's complaint about the
    Dulce report. The report is about 18 pages long, compared to K-2's 60
    pages, so it doesn't have much detail in it. The airborn magnetometer
    map looks like a shaded contour map. They don't give any examples of
    data like they do in the K-2 report.

    Now, going back to your message on K-2:

    I don't know why the report included useless information such as the
    lack of rodents, the feeling of being watched, and "boiling" clouds.
    The content of the report suggested they were paranoid.

    > unusual transmission and keeps monitoring it - with SW there are many
    > such transmissions.

    Yes, but these particular transmissions are strange. The
    transmissions sound like bizarre music. There is a voice on them
    repeating words that I just can't make out. It sounds like "see the
    bears"?<g> The transmissions carry no data. It sounds like a bizarre
    relaxation or subliminal suggestion tape with strange electronic
    sounds, including whale sounds. It has nothing to do with aliens.

    > A magnetometer is old technology at best - the portable kind aren't as
    > fine tuned and data productive as the report stated.

    It depends what type of magnetometer they were using. There is no
    mention of what type they used in the report. Modern magnetometers
    shouldn't have any problem detecting an alien base, since geologists
    use it to discover mineral deposits. I'm not familiar with the
    magnetometer's operation, but modern ones use some sort of nuclear
    resonance.

    >My interest would be seeing if the survey produced any unnatural
    >geometry.

    They made the conclusion that these tunnels and compartments were
    unnatural because they were aligned with magnetic north. They were
    apparently rectangular. These compartments were not connected in the
    field data, so they think there were adjoining tunnels that are
    magnetically disguised by the compartments near the surface.

    There were two large entrances that had dead-ends. One was 40 feet
    wide at the entrance and narrowed down to 15 feet; the total length was
    270 feet into the mountain. The section of the mountain (hill) that was
    surveyed included magnetometer readings above the accessable tunnels. I
    don't know why these entrances had dead-ends. Greys are suppose to have
    the power to pass through walls, so they could pass through the dead-
    end, but why is there an entrance tunnel at the surface? Inside the
    mountain, the magnetometer readings showed four chambers. One was 20
    feet by 75 feet with 10 feet wide tunnels extending 50+ feet to the
    north and to the south. This chamber was made of fused rock because the
    magnetometer readings above it had dropped. There were two tunnels that
    were 160+ and 190 feet long and 10 to 20 feet wide. The readings
    increased above them, so they apparently were metallic. On one side of
    the surveyed quadrant was a large chamber that extended beyond the 400
    foot quadrant and it was metallic. The actual size of the chamber was
    not determined. The chambers could be natural deposits, but the
    magnetic north-south orientation seems odd.

    >Since a mag was used - the formation must be fairly shallow

    They made no mention of depth, but I assume they could use a portable
    core drill. But, the Phoenix Project seems to be worried about
    appearing hostile toward the aliens, so trying to drill into their home
    would be a hostile act.

    >Further a professional look at the area would include a fresh aerial
    >survey with aerial stereo pix used to generate an AutoCad map of the
    >site. The next step would be a real look underground with GPR ground
    >penetrating radar and using an AutoLISP/AutoCad program to produce a 3-
    >d map. After looking at the results I could decide whether it would be
    >worth sinking a drill bit in for log or coring, etc.

    Gee...you sound like you're familiar with underground surveys. If you
    supply the equipment and the money, I'll lend a helping hand <G>.
    Well..I doubt the Phoenix Project would have enough money to do a
    complete survey. And I doubt anyone else would do that.

    >Further it might serve someones purpose to fabricate this data and
    >activity at K2 and wait and see who shows up. If the feds showed a
    >serious interest it would tend to promote the alien connection whether
    >the site is authentic or not...The most curious part of the report was
    >the pond - was this a beaver dam?

    I don't know why someone would hoax it. Just having the military or
    USGS there doesn't really strengthen "the alien connection". If the
    USGS wastes their time and finds out it's a mineral deposit or a hoax,
    then the Phoenix Project is dead.

    They apparently saw a Grey at the site and it `talked' to one of them.

    The pond is dyked, so humans created the `dam'.
    Paul

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    G. COX11 [GARY]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Paul

    Have they (Phoenix) done a report on the Dulce site? At least with all
    the activity at K2 something should come out of it. Maybe we can open a
    snack bar there to finance our stay?(g)

    On Cooper - the Psi BB had a message regarding a fight he got into with
    another UFO researcher - forgot the guys name - Van something - I've
    seen him on tv a few times. At least Cooper's story would explain
    things like the Landrum incident. With goverment testing of alien
    technology.

    I read something interesting recently - there are always tales about
    strange objects and artificial looking formations on the moon. There is
    an artificial appearing object near the crater archimedes and lower
    appenine highlands - in the mountains South of the great crater there
    appears to be a huge structure located in some foothills. Lunar Orbiter
    IV produced a poor photo of the object - and the area was
    rephotographed by Apollo 15. People have ordered 5"x48" Apollo 15
    mapping photos and have had them examined by high powered stereo
    microscopes and determined that the newer NASA photos have been
    airbrushed - the object erased. When comparing the various sets of NASA
    photos with some done at the Lick Observatory - it's clear NASA
    reworked things. Some people think this is done mainly to fool
    planetary scientist's here - who accept anything NASA gives them...

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    M. MASTALER [Mike]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Gary; Can you be VERY speccific on those lunar photos ? Do you have the
    nasa numbers of them ? I can go over to the *space topic, and someone
    there has access to these photos. then wo can maybe get some scientific
    feedback.

    Thanks Mike

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Gary,

    A snack bar is a good idea. I'm sure those aliens are pretty hungry.
    If you want the Dulce Report, there's DULCEDOC.ZIP in the library or,
    if you don't have an unZipper, there's DULCEDOC.TXT in the Space
    library. The spaceship in the Landrum case is strange, not like your
    average E.T. ship. Maybe it was an experimental reactor that caught
    fire. Somehow, I think the lawyer might have been able to do a better
    job at presenting the case. The judge expected high ranking military
    personnel to leak classified information, so the case died when they
    didn't. The reason why I don't like Cooper is because he gives out
    information that is obviously incorrect. Since he doesn't realize some
    things he says are blatantly wrong, it makes me think he is either a
    lousy researcher or he is making it up. Disinformation is a no-no for
    UFOlogists, it has poisoned his reputation within the UFO community.
    Reguarding the Moon pictures; I haven't heard about that, I'll ask
    around and see if anyone else has heard about it.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    GRAFFITI [Ric Helton]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    [1 =very= long message deleted, and the author asked to break it up or
    upload to the library....]

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    P. MIDDLER [Paul]:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    The Paranet message basically linked the Phoenix Project with America
    West Publishers and the Phoenix Liberator. They are known for their
    communications with a Commander Hattoon<sp>, who is in a spaceship that
    circles the Earth. Jack Mathias has often put down that organization,
    so it's funny that he's linked with them. The full story is still
    unknown to ParaNet and they are continuing their investigation. I will
    upload the ParaNet message and a file on Commander Hattoon into the
    library.

    ---

    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Saturday, June 20, 2026 06:11:00
    Filename: Phoenix2.Edi
    Type : Editorial/Opinion
    Author : John Pickens
    Date : 08/22/92
    Desc. : Observations on Phoenix Project's K2/Pilot's Peak report

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------




    REFLECTIONS ON THE K2 REPORT & OBSERVATIONS AT PILOT PEAK
    ---------------------------------------------------------

    Having read the Phoenix Project's K2 report and having visited the
    Pilot Peak area I offer some of my impressions and observations.

    Animal Sounds: The K2 Report suggests there is curious lack of animal
    sounds and indicated there is an unnatural quiet in the area.

    Having spent 2 nights in the immediate area in question I can say there
    was nothing I observed, either by night or by day, to support this
    contention. The level of animal sounds was consistent with what I have
    heard in other forested areas.

    Animal Life: The K2 report makes much of the fact that there was an
    absence of animal life in the area (this additionally supported by the
    claim of lack of animal sounds). In particular the report comments on
    the apparent absence of squirrels, chipmunks, rodents, owls and birds
    flying over the area.

    On my first night at the Pilot Peak area I spent the night at a spot
    over-looking the location of the "landing zones." I had an unobstructed
    view of the area. I was there while the Moon was still below the
    eastern horizon and I used a high-powered spotlight to illuminate the
    area. I saw no less than two (possibly three) deer - one of which was
    very close by, if not on, one of the "landing zones." Throughout the
    night, owls could be heard hooting. During the day birds could be seen
    flitting about the meadow that contained the "landing zones" and both
    squirrels and chipmunks were easily seen. At the very top of Pilot Peak
    there is a lookout station which I explored. There I found two
    exhausted boxes of D-Con rodent killer and rodent droppings in the
    first and second floors of the station - clearly evidence of rodents.
    Another variety of rodent - bats - were seen in no small numbers around
    the Pilot Peak area.

    I will comment on the K2 report itself concerning their claim of
    absence of animal life and animal sounds. I found it a curious
    contradiction that one of their observers (and I do not recall how they
    identified him/her, it was perhaps Contact #2, but it was the one who
    forgot their camera and had to come back the next day to make
    photographs) indicated that there was a sighting of a UFO and once it
    came into view all the animal noises ceased. I have to ask - If there
    was a curious and noteworthy lack of animal sounds how could they
    cease?

    Landing Zones: Having seen the purported "landing zones" personally,
    and in some cases having walked over them, I have to say there seems to
    be a more prosaic explanation. There was an abundance of deer tracks
    throughout the area. It is not unreasonable to assume these are places
    where deer have rested. I found it odd that in the midst of the
    flattened grass there was, in some instances, a variety of tall weed
    that was still standing, unbent, in the area of flattened grass. In
    addition, the "landing zones" exhibited none of the swirling patterns
    associated with UFO "nests" or the more recent crop circles. Very low
    strangeness index and certainly subject to more "Earthly" explanation
    than landed craft. I also found other, smaller, areas of flattened
    grass which looked exactly like the purported "landing zones" but which
    could clearly be discounted as such.

    There are two other factors which weigh heavily against these areas
    being "landing zones" which I will address next.

    Camping Area: Far from being the desolate area one might imagine from
    reading the K2 report there is a camping area immediately adjacent to
    the "landing zones." To the southwest, and just behind a moderately
    dense stand of trees, this camping area did not remain unoccupied
    during the time of my visit. On the first night there were three
    carloads of people camping and on the second night there was one family
    there. The area of the "landing zones" is easily seen from this camping
    area and access to the "landing zones" from the camping area is
    immediate. It is not the sort of area one would choose if one wanted
    any sort of privacy. In addition, the area of the "landing zones" is
    clearly seen from the road which passes nearby and the view from the
    road is unobstructed, save for two small trees, for over a quarter mile
    of travel.

    The Road: The report mentions a road which passes the K2 site. This is
    not the unused and long-forgotten road one would envision from reading
    the K2 report. Quite the contrary. During the day logging trucks, pick-
    up trucks, residents of the La Porte & Quincy areas and campers travel
    this road. While it will never resemble rush hour, I was somewhat
    surprised at the number of vehicles traveling that road as I thought we
    were well off the beaten track.

    At night the traffic is much less active. The first night there was no
    traffic from 9 PM until 4:15 AM the next morning. The second night
    there was traffic on and off throughout the night. Again, the meadow
    with the "landing zones" is clearly and unmistakably visible from the
    road.

    Forest Service: The K2 report alludes to the Forest Service personnel
    being mind-controlled minions of the Greys and says they were
    questioned about their reasons for being there. The report paints a
    picture of the Forest Service watching their every move and questioning
    their every action. I found quite the opposite to be the case. Not once
    did the Forest Service exhibit the slightest interest in what I was
    doing - even when I passed a Forest Service truck on the mine road (a
    dirt road that leads right to the base of the summit of Pilot Peak).
    The only reaction I received from the Forest Service was a smile and a
    wave as they drove past in their trucks.

    ---

    My observations cover a brief period of time - from the evening of
    Wednesday, August 19 to the morning of Friday, August 21. My comments
    and observations can be verified and confirmed by Mr. Ed Stuart who
    accompanied me to Pilot Peak.

    As Ed has asked, "If the facts we CAN verify are false then are the
    facts we CAN'T verify false?" To which I must reply, not necessarily,
    but they are certainly called into question.

    Other lines of inquiry come to mind. IS the corrdor from the west to
    Pilot Peak actually RADAR blind as put forth by the Phoenix Project K2
    report? I'm sure any ATC person from the area can answer that easily
    enough.

    I also think a discussion with Forest Service personnel is in order.
    Are they aware that some of their members are being presented as
    unwitting allies of the Greys? Did they have occasion to question the
    activities of a group of people investigating the Pilot Peak area? Has
    there ever been a female member of their team, and if so, who was she?
    And if so, what does she think of the seduction for information
    scenario as described by the K2 report?

    I think I'm ready to go ask some questions.


    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Saturday, June 20, 2026 06:12:00
    Filename: Phoenix3.Rpt
    Type : Report
    Author : Steve Jones
    Date : 08/23/92
    Desc. : Official report from the Sacramento UFO SIG on K2

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------


    The Sacramento UFO SIG (Special Interest Group) is a small group of
    individuals who have keen interest in expanding their knowledge on this
    subject. We have been meeting officially for one year and numerous
    members of this group have had significant encounters. Like most of
    you, we have a keen interesting in the Who, What and especially the Why
    on this subject.

    The SIG has made four trips up to K2 during the last 3 weeks, and at
    this point, to be frank, we have come up empty handed. This is not
    saying that there is nothing up there, but we are not seeing evidence
    of anything at this time. Due to the fact that there have been a flurry
    of sightings occurring approximately 75 miles to the south of K2 (Pilot
    Peak), both ourselves and apparently several MUFON members are of the
    opinion that the Greys may have moved their operations to the south.

    We have made the following observations.

    1. The area, although remote, is somewhat heavily traveled by the
    locals. This, we feel, is the reason for the very smooth surface
    of the road. Road traffic is light, if not nonexistent, at night
    (usually between about 9:00PM and around 4:00AM when the local
    loggers start coming through from Quincy to go to work at the
    logging sites). There seems to be extensive logging going on
    between the mountain and the junction of the Quincy- LaPorte Road
    and the road that goes up to Little Grass Valley Lake. It is our
    opinion that the reason that the road is paved from the base of
    the mountain, up and through the valley below the peak itself and
    to the top of the rise that over looks the Feather River canyon,
    is the possibility of eliminating washouts, especially along the
    face of the hill just below the valley entrance.

    2. The valley itself, which contains the Onion Valley creek, is not,
    in my opinion, anything unusual for the Sierras. The place is
    teeming with life, including bear, deer, owls, squirrels, birds,
    frogs and in the evening, loads of bats (which swarm down from the
    mountain). Two of the people who went up to the mountain (John
    Pickens and Ed Stewart) went up to the lookout and they said that
    there was a lot of evidence of extensive rat population up there.
    I have personally walked over approximately 75% of that valley
    floor and about 25% of the slope to the south (which is just below
    the face of the mountain. I have found very little evidence of
    anything out of the ordinary, especially cave or cavern openings.
    In fact, I found little if any indication that anyone had been
    walking up there within recent weeks.

    The pond is made from a small man-made dam, which appears to be at
    least 20 years old. I can see the distinct possibility that the
    forest service made it to create a water source in case of fires.
    I did see the area that the report mentions regarding the washed
    out part of the dam. The pond is, according to a man that one of
    our party interviewed, fish-less. It does, however, have several
    resident ducks, which make a considerable amount of noise during
    the night. The bats feed extensively on the insects that populate
    the pond and they are somewhat aggressive. You can toss a small
    stone up in the air and the bats will go after it. John Pickens
    showed us that little trick.

    3. We were only approached once by a local sheriff, who simply wanted
    to know what we were doing sitting by the side of the road late at
    night. This was just after he had left the campground which held a
    large group of local indians, who were camping there. These
    indians were very much aware of our presence and no doubt were
    concerned about us. Since the mountains of California are known to
    have drug farmers, it is prudent to maintain one's distance.
    Mountain folks are a quiet bunch and usually have little to say to
    "flat landers." We only saw US Forest Service Ranters driving
    their trucks on the road and we were never approached about why we
    were in the area.

    4. Pilot Peak (K2) is indeed in a fairly remote area, which given the
    patterns of life of the area, could be an ideal spot for some
    surreptitious activity. Logistical it is in a very good location,
    considering the local terrain, it's relationship to areas in
    Northern California and Nevada and it's relative ease of access.
    If I were going to build a secret base in Northern California,
    this area would be ideal. The roads leading to the site from the
    south are paved up to within 10 miles of the mountain and the
    loggers and the locals, use it extensively from 4:00AM until about
    9:00PM. As I have mentioned above from 9:00PM until 4:00AM, the
    road is deserted and the place is very quiet.

    The area to the west of the mouth of the U-shaped valley just
    below the peak goes into a long narrow canyon, which the Phoenix
    group describes in their report. I can see that this could be
    utilized to gain access below radar.

    5. The marshes behind and in front of the pond have tall rice-like
    grass and there are areas that appear to have been flattened, but
    not in the classic crop-circle sense. The pattern of the flattened
    grass is uni-directional and it does appear to have been folded
    over and braided, but there is no defined shape to the areas
    themselves. There are approximately 10 of these sites either below
    the dam or behind it and they all have signs of foot traffic going
    into them. The grass in these areas show signs of browning and do
    not show any of the signs of burning (either shaded or tip-burning
    as mentioned in the crop circle evidence). I walked the entire
    area of both marshes and saw no signs of circular burn marks.

    6. Regarding the comments that the Phoenix Group has made about the
    feelings that their team has regarding being watched, there were
    two separate incidents that occurred while we were up there that
    gives me pause to reflect.

    The first of these events occurred when my son and I originally
    went to the mountain three weeks ago. At the time, I didn't see
    the significance of it, but I do now. It was dusk and my son and I
    had set up my tripod and camera on the dam looking towards the
    peak. It was somewhat of a moonlight night and the bats had just
    come out. It was approximately 9:30PM on Saturday, the 8th of
    August. Suddenly I heard what appeared to be the sounds of bear
    cubs. I immediately recognized the sounds, having spend years in
    the woods. Instantly, I had the uneasy feeling that mother bear
    might be close and I told my son to take the tripod and we should
    quietly go back to the car. Since we hadn't intended to stay the
    night, we decided to leave the area. The location of these noises
    were approximately 150 feet up the side of the mountain to the
    South-South West of the southern tip of the dam.

    On the evening of Wednesday, the 12th I went up to the mountain by
    myself and spent the night parked by the side of the main road
    which is slightly above the valley floor and has an excellent view
    of the entire valley. The only significant noise that I heard that
    night was from a very loud owl, who hooted from the very same area
    that the bear noises emminate from.

    On Saturday, the 15th, myself and Ed Stewart spent the afternoon
    and early evening up at K2. I walked up the side of the hill to
    the south, southeast of the pond with Ed and we set up some
    listening equipment (sensitive mikes, including one contact mike,
    which I set up on some solid granite). Suddenly, Ed said, "What
    was that???", motioning over into the same area of the hillside
    that I have previously mentioned with the owl and bear sounds. It
    gave me a very short term feeling of uneasiness, but it pasted. At
    that point I was under the impression that we were sitting over
    the area that was supposed to have the base entrance. Later, I
    found out that I was wrong.

    Last night, on the evening of August 22nd, I spoke to Jack Mathias
    on the phone. I essentially told him what I have transcribed here
    with the exception of the strange noises and their locations. I
    told him that we had been looking for the base entrances and were
    having trouble finding them. It was then that he told me that the
    main one was to the south- southwest of the southern tip of the
    dam, approximately 150-165 feet up the side of the hill and that
    apparently I had been looking at the wrong place all along.
    Whether the locations of the noises that myself, Ed Stewart and my
    son Kris have heard are in fact located nearer to the supposed
    entrance is still an open question. If so, the there is the
    possibility that someone may have been trying to warn us away, by
    playing mind games with us. I didn't think of it at the time, but
    this reminds me of the types of things that Whitley Streiber
    experienced. HUMMMM!!????

    In conclusion, we still have some unanswered questions regarding the
    K2 site. We do question some of the allegations of the Phoenix Group,
    but haven't closed the book yet. There is still the possibility that
    there is something going on up there, but we feel that the burden of
    proof is on the Phoenix Group. The data that they have listed in their
    report is outlined with some inconsistencies. The grid pattern for
    their magnetometer readings is devoid of X,Y co-ordinate markers
    corresponding to their readings. The maps of the area that they have
    listed in the report doesn't have marked on it the origin (0,0) point
    for the X,Y grid. For a scientific report, this is a very sizeable data
    error.

    We also have some problem with their conclusions regarding the road
    and it's usage, the quizzical nature of the rangers, the lack of life
    around the area and in particular the LZ sites that they mention. I can
    see that the place would make an excellent site for a secret base, but
    it's existence is still questionable. We have, as I have mentioned, not
    closed the book on this case, and will keep everyone posted.

    I would like to take this opportunity to give thanks to the very
    helpful efforts and support from Ed Stewart, John Pickens and my son
    Kristopher Jones. I have found that when it comes down to making a
    commitment to field research, there are often few, if any volunteers. I
    greatly appreciate those who participated. Thanks.

    Sincerely- Steve Jones, co-moderator of the Sacramento UFO SIG.



    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Saturday, June 20, 2026 06:12:00
    Filename: Phoenix4.Thd
    Type : Message Thread
    Author : Trevor Prinn
    Date : 08/03/92
    Desc : Some History on Jack Mathias


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    I was quite interested in the Phoenix Project stuff until I read that
    Paranet had obtained it from Jack L Mathias. About a year ago Jack
    appeared in the Issues forum on Compuserve (CIS) with a couple of SF
    stories he had written under the name Jay Lewis, and was claiming to be
    true stories. They told of how he had been abducted by aliens on
    numerous occasions and had eventually been informed by them that he was
    himself an alien implanted into a human body and was, in reality, the
    husband (or something) of one of his abductors. He was trying to get
    them published as fiction but I didn't think he was likely to succeed.

    In subsequent messages in the forum he mentioned things like having
    broken into an underground alien base and getting into a (gun?) fight
    with the greys who occupied it. He also claimed to have been taught
    some mind control and ESP techniques by the friendly aliens from the SF
    stories. The first of these I recognised from an early novel by AE Van
    Vogt and when I asked him if it was called the cortical thalamic pause
    he confirmed it enthusiastically and near enough asked me which aliens
    had taught it to me. When I told him where it came from he replied that
    he had never read any Van Vogt, and that that author must therefore
    have had some alien contact similar to his own. I didn't believe the
    first part of that because I had already noted that the Jay Lewis
    stories showed some stylistic similarities to Van Vogt. I thought of
    writing to Van Vogt to get his opinion about the second part but
    decided that it would probably just annoy him.

    Later Jack posted some information about a further technique he had
    been taught that enabled him to carry out telekinesis. This also looked
    rather familiar and an hour spent poking around my quite extensive SF
    collection turned up Jack of Eagles by James Blish. Not only did this
    describe exactly the same thing in some detail but Blish also made a
    deliberate mistake when quoting the Blackett equation (a formulation of
    Heisenburg indeterminacy), which Jack had witlessly copied. I don't
    know if it was significant but both of these SF books were inspired by
    Count Korzybski's exposition of General Semantics, Science and Sanity.

    I posted a reply that included a reference to a scene in Jack of Eagles
    so that Jack could, if he wished, continue our game without letting on
    to the other forum participants, but he didn't reply and posted no
    further messages in the forum. Not long after that money trouble forced
    me to reduce my CIS usage to just a mailbox and distribution point for
    my shareware business so I didn't know that he had returned with more
    of this stuff. By coincidence, I intended to rejoin the Issues forum in
    a week or two anyway, so I hope he is still there peddling this Phoenix
    stuff - he gave me a few good laughs last time around.

    (Sorry if that was a bit long but you know how it is when you are
    assigning someone's character.)

    Trev Prinn



    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Saturday, June 20, 2026 06:13:00
    Filename: Phoenix5.Thd
    Type : Message Thread
    Author : Jack Mathias
    Date : 09/02/02
    Desc : Reply/Rebuttal to Trevor Prinn's editorial message
    Directed to Michael Corbin

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------



    Michael.

    Have read the following and feel that I have the right to interject my
    thoughts, etc. Not so much as for a defense to merely to clarify the
    points. In order to limit the message size I will omit any areas that
    do not pertain.

    Oh, before I start I will say that I remember sharing messages with the
    originator, Trevor Prinn.

    ....Jack L Mathias.

    - - - -

    * Forwarded from "ParaNet UFO Echo"
    * Originally dated 08-30-92 2:10

    From: Trevor Prinn - "TP>" denotes quotes from Trevor Prinn's message.


    TP> I was quite interested in the Phoenix Project stuff until I read
    TP> that Paranet had obtained it from Jack L Mathias. About a year ago
    TP> Jack appeared in the Issues forum on Compuserve (CIS) with a couple
    TP> of SF stories he had written under the name Jay Lewis, and was
    TP> claiming to be true stories. They told of how he had been abducted
    TP> by aliens on numerous occasions and had eventually been informed by
    TP> them that he was himself an alien implanted into a human body and
    TP> was, in reality, the husband (or something) of one of his
    TP> abductors. He was trying to get them published as fiction but I
    TP> didn't think he was likely to succeed.

    - - - -

    Mr. Trevor Prinn is right to a point. I did get involved in the
    Paranormal Issues thread concerning UFOs etc and the topic of
    adductions did come up. And as Trevor states, I did put two files into
    the library which concerned the issue. However what Mr. Prinn says
    about numerous abductions isn't exactly the way I put it. I told of my
    1988 abduction and through this I learned I had been also abducted
    during my childhood. To date, I have been unable to recall any of the
    details and based my statement solely on what my abductors showed me.

    The part where Prinn states ... "informed by them that he was himself
    an alien implanted into a human body and was, in reality, the husband
    (or something) of one of his abductors" .. doesn't add up. However, in
    the story that I put into the library *The Recall* by J. Lewis, I did
    describe events that to this day I still belive to be real. As I stated
    at the time I wrote the stores as fiction because I knew that no one
    would believe them to be factual. Even I had trouble believing it.

    - - - -

    TP> In subsequent messages in the forum he mentioned things like having
    TP> broken into an underground alien base and getting into a (gun?)
    TP> fight with the greys who occupied it.

    - - - -


    I made no such claim. However if I remember correctly there were some
    people participating in the thread who tried to make this assumption.
    FYI this base is the one mentioned in the Phoenix Project K2 Report and
    if you have had the opportunity to read exhibit 21, I am the person who
    met and conversed with the Grey. However, at no time were there any
    hostil actions nor did anyone enter the base.

    - - - -

    TP> He also claimed to have been taught some mind control and ESP
    TP> techniques by the friendly aliens from the SF stories. The first of
    TP> these I recognised from an early novel by AE Van Vogt and when I
    TP> asked him if it was called the cortical thalamic pause he confirmed
    TP> it enthusiastically and near enough asked me which aliens had
    TP> taught it to me. When I told him where it came from he replied that
    TP> he had never read any Van Vogt, and that that author must therefore
    TP> have had some alien contact similar to his own. I didn't believe
    TP> the first part of that because I had already noted that the Jay
    TP> Lewis stories showed some stylistic similarities to Van Vogt. I
    TP> thought of writing to Van Vogt to get his opinion about the second
    TP> part but decided that it would probably just annoy him.

    - - - -

    I still make the claim that I have not read any of the stories
    mentioned by Mr. Prinn.

    - - - -

    TP> Later Jack posted some information about a further technique he had
    TP> been taught that enabled him to carry out telekinesis.

    - - - -

    I stated that I experimented and had little sucess. I said I was able
    to make a piece of paper vibrate but could not lift it. Someone,
    possibly Mr. Prinn suggested using a paper clip, stating it would work
    better. Unfortunately, I had no success there, either.

    - - - -


    TP> This also looked rather familiar and an hour spent poking around my
    TP> quite extensive SF collection turned up Jack of Eagles by James
    TP> Blish. Not only did this describe exactly the same thing in some
    TP> detail but Blish also made a deliberate mistake when quoting the
    TP> Blackett equation (a formulation of Heisenburg indeterminacy),
    TP> which Jack had witlessly copied. I don't know if it was significant
    TP> but both of these SF books were inspired by Count Korzybski's
    TP> exposition of General Semantics, Science and Sanity.

    - - - -

    I continue to make the same claim as above. I have not read any of the
    books mentioned. As for the Blackett equation I did use it but it
    wasn't until after Mr. Prinn said what it was that I knew this.

    - - - -

    TP> I posted a reply that included a reference to a scene in Jack of
    TP> Eagles so that Jack could, if he wished, continue our game without
    TP> letting on to the other forum participants, but he didn't reply and
    TP> posted no further messages in the forum. Not long after that money
    TP> trouble forced me to reduce my CIS usage to just a mailbox

    - - - -

    Seems Mr. Prinn suffered the same fate I did. However I ceased my
    connection in Issues/Paranormal when people started saying I should
    contact Don Ecker of MUFON. [At least I think that was the person they
    wanted me to contact. I am certain about MUFON. Ufortunately, I firmly
    believed and still believe that would have been a dangerous move.

    - - - -

    TP> and distribution point for my shareware business so I didn't know
    TP> that he had returned with more of this stuff. By coincidence, I
    TP> intended to rejoin the Issues forum in a week or two anyway, so I
    TP> hope he is still there peddling this Phoenix stuff - he gave me a
    TP> few good laughs last time around.
    TP>
    TP> (Sorry if that was a bit long but you know how it is when you are
    TP> assigning someone's character.) Trev Prinn

    - - - -

    I am also sorry this is so long, Michael. I failed to cut any of it
    because in the long run, it all counted.

    I will say this, however. When I got involved in Issues/Paranomral I
    had no idea, what-so-ever that the Phoenix Project would ever release
    any of our information. Had I, I sure wouldn't have input the
    information I did because as you can see, it did, discredit me. At
    least in Mr. Prinn's mind.

    Sincerely

    J. L Mathias. [Yes, the L stands for Lewis]


    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:09:00
    Filename: Phoenix6.Txt
    Type : Editorial/Opinion
    Author : Joseph Harris -CIS: 70714,3321
    Date : 10/21/92
    Desc. : Editorial on the K2 Report
    Cis Id# : 70714,3321

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------


    The Validity of "THE K-2 REPORT"
    -Joseph Harris



    Some time ago I decided to further investigate the claims of the
    Phoenix Project in regards to their K2 Report about a supposed
    underground alien base located near Quincy CA. This report chronicles
    my initial findings. It is not my intention to discredit the Phoenix
    Project, or Jack Mathias. They, as a scientific organization, should be
    able to appreciate any attempt at independant verification.

    The following is excerpted directly from the K-2 Report, and chronicles
    an "object" being pursued by 8 F-4 Phantoms.

    * * *

    Report # 1: By Staff # 2:
    Date: August 10, 1989, Time: 2212 PDT.
    Location: Approximately 40 miles southwest of K-2.

    A brightly glowing object was observed from my location. It was
    approximately 30-40 feet in diameter, moving slowly from south to north
    at 500 feet above the tree-tops.

    [text deleted for brevity]

    Within 10 minutes, after the object left the area, eight Air Force
    jet fighters (F-4s, judging from their sound and appearance) and moving
    very fast, went overhead traveling in the same direction the object had
    taken -- towards the North. Four minutes later, the fighters returned,
    heading south. I presumed the object had been spotted by their radar.
    Their quick return would indicate they lost radar contact with the
    object.

    * * *

    [text deleted for brevity]

    Memo
    August 12, 1989
    From Staff # 1
    To: Staff # 2

    Our contacts in the Air Force verify that on the night of August 10,
    1989, at the time indicated in Report # 1 of that date, that eight F-
    4's, scrambled from Beale AFB, CA. They had a brief radar-lock, on a
    "bogie" in the area described. However, they lost the target, due to
    ground clutter when it suddenly descended into the mountainous terrain.
    They returned to the base when a further sweep of the area proved
    fruitless.

    You're right, the AF had a blip on their radar, but lost it when the
    ship dropped into that 20-mile approach corridor between the valleys
    and the radar dead zone.

    * * *

    My Investigation.

    I contacted the Public Affairs office at Beale AFB. (916-634-8890)
    After identifying myself, and the information I needed, they transfered
    me to another office. The person who answered the phone identified both
    himself, and the office so swiftly, I couldn't make out who I was
    talking to. (altho the point is moot..)

    The following is a -rough- transcript of the conversation, although it
    is not verbatim. (I did not record the conversation.) The officer I was
    speaking to was quite candid, and informal. The conversation itself was
    spontaneous, so I do not believe that I was being fed a "canned" story.
    Besides, as you'll see in a moment, the officer has absoloutly no
    reason to lie about this. I read the above memo to the officer, and
    then asked the following questions.

    Q: Has Beale AFB operated F-4 Phantoms in an interceptor role at any
    time, and specificly during August of 1989?

    A: No. Beale AFB is a SAC [Strategic Air Command] base, and has never
    operated tactical aircraft in any capacity. We have B-52s, KC-130
    air refuelers, and until recently, the SR-71. We're a bomber base,
    not a fighter base. There was an attempt made in an 89 air show to
    get 2 RF-4Cs to come here, but unfortunatly, they couldn't make it.

    [Note: In conversation, he told me the RF-4s were part of the High
    Roller squadron based here in Reno...Joe.]

    Q: Were F-4s ever used in an interceptor role as late as 1989?

    A: Not to my knowledge, no. The F-4s have been relegated to ECM, "Wild
    Weasel" roles, and low level recce [Recon] roles for quite some time
    now. These types of F-4s are completely unarmed, therefor useless as
    fighters. If an intercept mission was called out for northern CA,
    the response would come from only one of 2 AFB's. Eilson<sp> or
    Almendorf AFB in Alaska, although I'm not sure which one, and the
    other AFB would be March AFB. Both bases have a wing of F-15
    interceptors that the AF have assigned to West Coast defense. The US
    Navy also has NAS [Naval Air Stations] assigned to coastal defense,
    but I'm not sure which bases those are. At any rate, the only Naval
    outfits to use the F-4 are the Marines, and they also use it as
    "Wild Weasel" and low level recce.

    Q: Has it ever been AF SOP to use eight aircraft in an intercept?

    A: For -one- radar bogie? [he laughed at this point] That would insult
    most of the fighter pilots I've ever known. [another laugh] No, most
    AFB's only have 2 aircraft capable of being "scrambled" on a moments
    notice. Even if an AFB had more aircraft available for a scramble,
    they would still only send 2 aircraft. Operating an interceptor is
    extremly expensive, somwhere in the region of $4,000 per flight
    hour. This is fuel, oil, hydraulics, and air and ground crew
    salaries. The AF wouldn't spend $32,000 for something they know from
    experience would only take $8,000. Besides, we're still talking F-4s
    here right? [Yes] Well, for an intercept conducted by the AF, you're
    looking at the F-15, or the F-16. Even if we had F-4s that were
    armed, they wouldn't use them. They're just not fast enough anymore.

    * * *

    There was more to this conversation, but we got to talking about the
    High Rollers and the Reno Air races.. the above is the only portion
    that pertains to this report...

    Summary:

    1. Beale AFB is a SAC base, and as such, does not operate tactical
    aircraft, (ie fighters) in any capacity, and never has. Their
    primary aircraft types are bombers, hi-alt recon, and refuelers.

    2. The AF would never send eight ships to intercept a radar bogie. IMHO
    they wouldn't need to.

    3. There are no F-4 Phantoms being used on the West Coast in an
    interceptor role. They are used in Recon, and ECM roles only, and as
    such, are totally unarmed. If the AF were to scramble an intercept,
    they would use F-16s or F-15s.


    Possible Explanations:

    1. The AF is lieing.

    Not likely. They've no reason to hide the fact that tactical
    aircraft do not operate from their base, nor have they any reason to
    lie about not using F-4s as interceptors.

    2. The Phoenix Project member mis-identified the aircraft.

    Unfortunatly, the Phoenix Project cannot use this as a defense,
    since they state that they "verified" that 8 F-4s were scrambled to
    intercept the radar "bogie."

    3. The Phoenix Project deliberatly falsified this portion of their
    report.

    Unfortunatly, this is the only explanation.

    Conclusion:

    It is my opinion that at least this portion of the Phoenix Project's K-
    2 report is a deliberate falsehood. It can neither be a typographical
    error, nor an error in judgement, (since they "verified" the info using
    AF sources.) This also throws considerable doubt on the validity of the
    "object" sighting, and on the K-2 report as a whole. However, I will
    let others, more knowledgable and capable than I, determine the
    validity of the remaining K-2 claims.

    Joe.

    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:10:00
    Filename : Phoenix7.Reb
    Type : Rebuttal
    Author : Jack Mathias
    Date : 10/25/92
    Desc : Rebuttal to Joseph Harris
    Note : Also see Phoenix6.Txt

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Joseph and All readers....

    This is not a message from the Phoenix Project, proper but I will
    state that at this time they still back the report that I transmitted
    as truth.

    I, however, cannot verify any of the information posted regarding the
    alleged F-4's that were reportedly scrambled. All I know is what I have
    been told and I have spoken with the investigator. He still claims that
    what he heard [and possibly saw ... I am not sure here] was the sound
    of the very familiar F-4. Speaking with others in the Air Force has
    indicated to me that these craft have a very definite sound signature.

    And I also don't doubt the information supplied regarding your talk
    with officials at Beal. What he said is true. However the report never
    repeat never stated that the planes in question came out of Beal. Nor
    did it claim whose planes they were. Personally, I would think a F-4
    equipped with nose cameras would be the ideal craft to be used if there
    might have been a chance to get pictures. But my thinking would be that
    these planes might be more interested in where the unknowns went and
    not what they were. I am sure they [the elite forces behind the
    mystery] have sufficient pictures of alien craft already.

    If the Phoenix Project has anything to say on this topic you can rest
    assured that I will transmit it.

    Jack

    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:11:00
    Filename: Phoenix8.Reb
    Type : Rebuttal
    Author : Joseph Harris
    Date : 10/26/92
    Desc : Rebuttal to Jack Mathias
    Note : Also See Phoenix7.Reb (Phoenix7.Zip)

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    JM> And I also don't doubt the information supplied regarding your talk
    JM> with officials at Beal. What he said is true. However the report
    JM> never repeat never stated that the planes in question came out of
    JM> Beal.

    That doesn't jive with The Phoenix report Jack... here, I'll let you
    read it again, and THEN tell me that the report "never, repeat never,
    stated that the planes in question came out of Beale."

    * * *

    Memo
    August 12, 1989
    From Staff # 1
    To: Staff # 2

    Our contacts in the [Air Force] verify that on the [night] of
    August 10, 1989, at the time indicated in Report # 1 of that date,
    that eight F-4's, [scrambled from Beale [AFB]], CA. They had a
    brief radar-lock, on a "bogie" in the area described. However, they
    lost the target, [due to ground-] [clutter] when it suddenly
    descended into the mountainous terrain. They returned to the base
    when a further sweep of the area proved fruitless.

    You're right, the [AF] had a blip on their radar, but lost it
    when the ship dropped into that 20-mile approach corridor between
    the valleys and the radar dead zone.

    [ The bracketed portions are for emphasis.]
    [ Each one will be discussed below... ]

    * * *

    This is a DIRECT quote from the report Jack. Anyone here who saves
    reports like this can verify this for me.


    JM> Nor did it claim whose planes they were.

    The Air Force is mentioned 3 times in that one memo alone.

    JM> Personally, I would think a F-4 equipped with nose cameras would be
    JM> the ideal craft to be used if there might have been a chance to get
    JM> pictures.

    Ideal?


    First, taking pics of the object with an F-4 is impossible unless they
    take the jet pure vertical to take the picture. Their cameras are
    pointed at the ground, not out in front of them. If they wanted to know
    where the "object" was going, THEY WOULDN'T USE AN AIRCRAFT THAT IS
    SLOWER THAN EVERY OTHER A.F. INTERCEPTOR!. The F-4s max speed is Mach
    2. The F-15's max speed is 2.5! (roughly 350 mph faster than the F-4)
    Also, for a prolonged chase, the F-15's range is required, and far
    exceeds that of the F-4. The F-4s, with drop tanks, max out at 1978
    miles. The F-15's range is 3,570 miles! (also with drop tanks)

    The F-15 also has the "look-down" "shoot-down" radar, which means,
    unlike the F-4, no target could get "lost" due to ground clutter.

    Another major problem is that F-4s equipped for low level recon fly
    VERY low, like, 100 feet off the deck.

    THEY HAVE -NO- TERRAIN GUIDANCE EQUIPMENT.

    It's entirely "seat-of-the-pants" flying by pilot skill alone. They fly
    and take pictures during daylight hours only! Which also means, (guess
    what?), THEIR CAMERAS CAN NOT TAKE PHOTOS AT NIGHT!

    Your ideal aircraft to send up after a bogie?

    Slow, blind, and toothless.


    JM> But my thinking would be that these planes might be more interested
    JM> in where the unknowns went and not what they were. I am sure they
    JM> [the elite forces behind the mystery] have sufficient pictures of
    JM> alien craft already.

    Common Sense dictates that, even if you wanted to just "see where
    they're going," the F-15 is the obvious choice. The G'vt could then go
    in later and take as many detailed hi-alt pics of the area that they
    wanted to with the U-2, or the SR-71, with no-one the wiser.

    As John Hicks said, I too, have no axe to grind with you or the Phoenix
    Project. I -DO- have an axe ready for deliberate mis-information.
    Unfortunatly, I downloaded this mail after leaving the University of
    Nevada's Library. Consequently, I will be preparing another report
    about the rest of the K-2 claims shortly. I have to wait for one more
    piece of mail before I can post this report, so please be patient.

    JM> If the Phoenix Project has anything to say on this topic you can
    JM> rest assured that I will transmit it.

    Jack Do me a favor Jack, and ask them these questions for me:


    1. How can 8 F-4s be scrambled from a base that has NEVER operated
    fighter aircraft of ANY type?

    3. Why did the Phoenix Project NOT follow standard scientific
    procedures with regards to their magnatometer readings? (collect he
    data, and then -verify- it by different means. Thermal Imaging,
    ground penetrating radar, or ultra-sonics?)

    And the biggie...

    4. WHY DID THEY WAIT THREE YEARS BEFORE RELEASING THIS REPORT!?

    Joe.


    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:11:00
    Filename: Phoenix9.Edi
    Type : Editorial/Opinion
    Author : Sean Pobuda
    Date : 10/27/92
    Desc : Editorial on the Phoenix Project's K2 Report


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    I have been reading with interest the publications of the "Phoenix
    Project" which, if believed, are evidence for the presence of an alien
    base in California. I would, however, like to point out one more
    discrepancy in their story. In Report #4, the following information is
    given regarding a UFO sighting:

    By Staff #2
    Date: August 10, 1989
    Time: 2212 PDT

    ..."the moon was still below the horizon."

    Now here is one place where a simple fact is stated and can be checked.
    I did. Using four separate planetarium and moon position calculation
    programs, I determined that the moon on that night at that time was as
    follows:

    RA : 16 hr 8 min
    DEC : -26.17 degrees (this means in the constellation of Scorpio)
    Phase: 9.5 days passed new moon (waxing gibbous)

    What this means is that the moon would be between first quarter and
    full, and would have risen before sunset and been in the sky during the
    evening hours before midnight. The report states that the sky was clear
    with stars visible.

    The moon was low in the western horizon, but certainly not "...still
    below the horizon."

    What is interesting is that no one has (to my knowledge) checked this
    simple statement. Since the moon had certainly already risen and should
    have been visible in the sky, one might assume that the statement it
    hat not yet risen (was "still below the horizon") was put in to help
    eliminate the moon as a possible explanation for the UFO sighting. Did
    the author, therefore, add this statement so no one could accuse him of
    mistaking the moon for a UFO? This is what you would expect of someone
    who was making up a story, not the on-site notes of an actual observer.
    Apparently the bit about the moon not yet having risen was added
    without checking the moon's actual position on that night.

    In anticipation of a counter-argument that since the moon was close to
    its setting time and, in a moutainous area, might possibly have already
    gone behind a mountain and therefore not be visible to the observer, I
    can only point out that in that case the observer, who had been on
    watch for a while at least, would have seen the moon earlier and known
    that it had just set. He would, therefore, not describe it as "the moon
    was still below the horizon." That certainly implies that the moon had
    not yet risen, when, in fact, it had been in the sky all evening.

    My feeling is that 99.9999 percent of all UFO reports and claims are
    fakes, mistakes, hoaxes, mis-identifications, and other human errors.
    But let us continue our search for a little signal in all that noise
    (to steal a phrase from engineering).

    Yours,
    Sean



    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:12:00
    Filename: Phoeni10.Edi
    Type : Editorial/Opinion
    Author : Joseph Harris
    Date : 10/31/92
    Desc : The validity of the K-2 report: Addendum 1 & 2
    CIS : 70714,3321


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Addendum 1
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------


    The Validity of the K-2 Report: Addendum 1 & 2
    By: Joseph Harris


    There is a problem with the K-2 Report that was so obvious, it
    remained hidden until I printed it out and poured over it while at
    work. (Nothing better to do.. :^) I started by hi-lighting all the
    dates and times given in the Information Update portion of the report.
    Then I started doodling like so...

    8-10-92 2215 PDT: Staff #1 receives phone call.

    Anyway, I made myself a little time-line of events, and 2 very
    obvious errors showed up.

    I'll quote only the pertinent data from the K-2 report so there is
    proof of what they released.. the real clincher is the time-line that
    follows:

    Remember.. we're looking at the sequence of events here:

    INFORMATION UPDATE

    Date: August 16, 1989
    From: Staff # 1
    Subject: Activity Reports concerning K-2
    Comment from Staff # 1:
    Date: August 10, 1989, Time: 2215 PDT.
    At 2215 PDT, I received a phone call from Staff # 2

    [text deleted]

    I received the following information from Staff # 2 on August 14, 1989.

    * * *

    Report # 1: By Staff # 2
    Date: August 10, 1989,
    Time: 2212 PDT.
    Location: Approximately 40 miles southwest of K-2.

    It remained stopped for approximately 15 seconds, then
    [text deleted]
    The sighting lasted approximately 45 seconds. There
    [text deleted]
    Within 10 minutes, after the object left the area,
    [text deleted]
    towards the North. Four minutes later, the fighters
    [text deleted]

    * * *

    [report #3 and #4 deleted, reports from Staff 2 about forgetting his
    camera... yeah right.]

    Memo
    August 12, 1989
    From Staff # 1
    To: Staff # 2

    Our contacts in the Air Force verify that on the night of August 10,
    1989, at the time indicated in Report # 1 of that date, that eight F-
    4's, scrambled from Beale AFB,

    [text deleted]

    * * *

    Time Line:

    Aug 10 92: 2212 PDT Staff # 2 Object sighting begins. [Report #1]
    Aug 10 92: 2215 PDT Staff # 1 receives phone call.

    This is the first major error. According to the text of Report #1,
    the sighting lasted 45 seconds, then 10 minutes later the F-4s show up,
    and 4 minutes after that the F-4s return. A total event time of 14m
    45s. Yet Staff #2 called Staff #1 only 3 minutes after the initial
    sighting. This in and of itself proves nothing, but becomes MUCH more
    relevant to the next major error.

    Aug 12 89: Staff #1 verifies AF activity as stated in Report # 1.
    Aug 14 89: Staff #1 RECEIVES Report # 1
    Aug 16 89: Staff #1 Begins Information Update.

    Do you see the error? I'll let you re-read the portion of the Aug 12
    statement...

    Our contacts in the Air Force verify that on the night of August 10,
    1989, at the time indicated in Report # 1 of that date, that eight F-
    4's, scrambled from Beale AFB,

    HOW COULD HE VERIFY DATES AND TIMES IN A REPORT HE WOULDN'T RECEIVE
    FOR TWO MORE DAYS???

    Here's the line from Staff #1:

    I received the following information from Staff # 2 on August 14, 1989.

    * * *

    Report # 1: By Staff # 2:
    Date: August 10, 1989, Time: 2212 PDT.

    Now is where the first error becomes important. If the time was but 3
    minutes between the start of the sighting, and the phone call to Staff
    #1, then Staff #1 had NO WAY OF KNOWING ABOUT THE JETS FROM THE PHONE
    CALL. The jets didn't show for 10 minutes, remember? There was a swift
    conversation, and then no further phone communication, since they were
    worried about wire taps. I doubt that the Phoenix Project will be able
    to claim that this was a simple typo, as all the rest of the memos and
    comments follow a very precise pattern. They attempted to show us that
    the Phoenix Project members are scientific, and detail oriented. All
    they succeeded in doing was putting holes in their report one could
    drive a truck through.

    There is another curiosity in the K-2 Report, but that will be posted
    in a second message, as this one is long enough.

    Conclusion:

    Staff # 1 directly referanced a document that by their own report he
    would not receive for 2 more days. This is a glaring error, and one
    that would not have happened if the report were anything but a work of
    pure fiction.


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Addendum 2
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    This is a simple curiosity about the K-2 Report, and not, exactly, an
    error. It does however, raise a question or two:

    [Quote from K-2]

    Comments by Staff # 1
    Date: 8/29/89

    Observations of night-time activity at K-2, over the past month,
    indicate that alien crafts are making supply runs at two week
    intervals. All of our attempts, on site, to photograph or video tape
    their arrival, unloading and departures have failed. The aliens seem to
    detect our presence even though we have made every effort to remain
    concealed. On two occasions, from our concealed location, we have
    observed one of their craft making a landing approach. The craft
    suddenly veers off, about two miles from the base, and quickly leaves
    the area. For both practical and economic reasons we cannot continue
    this surveillance. In our opinion, we have validated the existence of
    the base and the alien activity associated with this site.

    * * *

    Two problems with this:

    1. From what they say, all attempts to photograph or video tape the
    objects have failed.

    Yet they also say that on 2 occasions they observed landing craft
    making an approach, but turning away while still 2 miles out.

    Sorry guys, but ANYTHING you can see, you can photograph and video
    tape. You don't mean to tell me that trained scientific- military
    people went to observe a supposed alien base and FORGOT THEIR
    CAMERAS? That makes about as much sense as the guy who went to the
    LZ and saw landing marks, but conveniently forgot his camera.

    2. They also state that over the course of the "last month" the aliens
    have been making regular supply runs at 2 week intervals. That
    doesn't jive with the rest of the report. That would have covered
    most of the month of August, in which we already know that at least
    one sighting was made. Why no mention of the others? Why was Staff
    # 2 so excited about his sighting on the tenth if this was to be
    expected? How can they state with such confidence that the supply
    runs are regular? If they make the supply runs every two weeks,
    then they would only have had 2 chances to observe them. Hardly
    enough data to base the opinion that these are regular supply
    runs...

    " In our opinion, we have validated the existence of the base and the
    alien activity associated with this site."

    This line deserves absoloutly no comment...

    Conclusion:

    This portion of the K-2 report raises more questions about it's
    credibility in general. If the US postal service were a bit faster, I'd
    be able to post quite a bit more about the K-2 report. Until I receive
    my confirming data though, this will have to remain simply as a
    teaser... sorry. :^)

    Joe.


    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:13:00
    Filename: Phoeni11.Edi
    Type : Editorial/Opinion
    Author : Don Kircher
    Date : 10/23/92
    Desc : Editorial of K2 Alien Transmission Tape

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Copyrighted Radio Transmissions from Aliens


    Abstract

    K-2; the alleged alien base in the Plumas National Forest is branded
    a hoax by default when the recorded radio transmission is found to be a
    copy of a tape which was available in bookstores across the country.

    Key Words

    Phoenix Project,K-2,Underground Base,Alien,Plumas National Forest
    Pilot Point, PP report #920627, hoax


    From the moment I became aware of the Roswell case I have maintained
    an ongoing interest in crashed ufos, direct contact, and abductions. I
    tend to be more open to statements than some, taking an innocent until
    proven guilty attitude, rather than the more adversarial "show me"
    stance. ( I am not from Missouri ). This means I listen to everything.
    I save everything. I cross index everything. But I challenge very
    little. The jury remains out until something is produced which can
    withstand the scientific method, or is good enough to go before a
    courtroom judge. The result is a very large "wait and see" file, and
    occasionally a solidly closed case.

    My wait and see attitude combined with a healthy dose of dumb luck
    has permitted me to move the K-2 report squarely from the wait and see
    file into the closed section. Cross indexed under HOAX.

    I have closely monitored the netmail concerning the K-2 report since
    the story first broke in June. Direct e mail with the spokesman for the
    Phoenix Project and conversations with other interested parties have
    consumed a sizeable portion of my storage space. Yet I remained
    unwilling to send the Phoenix Project the money it desired for an
    original copy of the reports.

    Conversations with David Brune led to an arrangement for him to send
    me his copy of the K-2 report along with a copy of the taped radio
    transmission which led the Phoenix Project to investigate the K-2 site
    to begin with. I received the packet in early October and was surprised
    to find the contents of the tape familiar to me.

    It should be noted that the tape received from David is labeled K-2
    Radio Transmission Monaural (58:20) and was associated with a
    descriptive paper noting its origin having been recorded on June, 5,
    1989 at 0200 PDT from shortwave frequency 16.222 Megahertz at
    Forbestown, California. A note from the technical data states that
    "Oscilloscope observation of the recorded signal reveals the presence
    of pulsed digital information impressed on the predominant analog audio
    signal components". It then goes on to say that "This digital data may
    be encrypted".

    This description of the K-2 radio transmission is inconsistent with
    my own findings. The actual contents of the K-2 tape are a monaural
    reproduction of a tape which I purchased several years ago from a local
    bookstore. I am happy to say that after some digging in my garage I was
    able to locate my STEREO commercial production tape, and that it is
    still in good condition. My own tape is labeled ASTRAL SOUNDS and was
    copyrighted 1973 by The American Research Team. The tape was
    distributed under license by POTENTIALS UNLIMITED, INC. Potentials
    Unlimited marketed a wide variety of self help/self hypnosis/subliminal
    message tapes in the late eighties. Their products were available in
    the big chain bookstores such as Waldons and B Daltons. The original
    intent of the ASTRAL SOUNDS tape was to synchronized sound with brain
    wave frequencies for some interesting effects during
    listening/meditation.

    Both tapes have been donated to Paranet for the listening pleasure of
    serious researchers. If you have been considering purchasing ANYTHING
    from the PHOENIX PROJECT. I strongly advise you to reconsider.

    Regards
    Donald Kircher


    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:13:00
    Filename: Phoeni12.Thd
    Type : Thread
    Author : Jack Mathias
    Date : 11/25/92
    Desc : Phoenix Project Thread

    Note : Please download Phoeni13.Thd for the continuance of this
    thread. For purposes of reference, it was necessary to keep
    this file in it's original context/content and as a separate
    unit.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    (Quoting Joseph Harris)

    JH> Is it just me or does it appear as though Jack Mathias has made
    JH> himself extremely scarce since I reminded him of Richard Miller's
    JH> involvement with the PP?
    JH> Joseph...

    Sorry, but I am not making myself scarce. I have been patiently
    sitting here and waiting for you to respond to my last message. The one
    in which I told you that I was `well aware' of whom Richard Miller was.
    So far, you have made yourself scarce.


    As for the original message quoted above, the one that Don Kirshner
    sent Corbin and he re-entered I will be sending out a response. Stay
    tuned. Nothing that can legitamently hoax the Phoenix Project has yet
    been introduced.

    Jack

    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jim Singleton@RICKSBBS to All on Sunday, June 21, 2026 06:14:00
    Filename: Phoeni13.Thd
    Type : Message Thread
    Author : Joseph Harris
    Date : 11/25/92
    Desc : Reply to Phoeni12.Thd

    Note : Please download "Phoeni12.Thd/Phoeni12.Zip" to which this
    messages is a reply.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    (Quoting Jack Mathias)

    JM> Sorry, but I am not making myself scarce. I have been patiently
    JM> sitting here and waiting for you to respond to my last message. The
    JM> one in which I told you that I was `well aware' of whom Richard
    JM> Miller was. So far, you have made yourself scarce.

    Ok, fine. Included in this message pack will be as many documents, from
    as many sources as I can grab, detailing everything known to date about
    the Phoenix Project. Read them all, and -then- tell me there is no
    reason to question the PP's credibility.

    JM> As for the original message quoted above, the one that Don Kirshner
    JM> sent Corbin and he re-entered I will be sending out a response.
    JM> Stay tuned. Nothing that can legitamently hoax the Phoenix Project
    JM> has yet been introduced.

    WHAT!? The small -FACT- that the Phoenix Project LIED in it's public
    report seems to have gone in one ear and out the other Jack.

    FACT: The Phoenix Project LIED when it stated they had verified a
    scramble of eight F-4's from Beale AFB. This alone throws enough
    doubt on the Phoenix Project's remaining claims to shread the K-2
    report's credibility, but there's more...

    FACT: Your "Staff #1" LIED when he directly referanced a document that
    he would not receive for TWO MORE DAYS. (I've yet to hear ANY
    explanation for this one.)

    FACT: NO one ( and I thank SUFOG for this data) has yet to verify any
    of the information in the Phoenix Project's data through on-site
    investigations.

    FACT: One of the principal members of the Phoenix Project's publishing
    Company (Advent) is Richard Miller. Mr. Miller was the original
    Hatonn channeler, and in my opinion throws enormous doubt upon
    the Phoenix Project whether he is still associated with the
    Phoenix Liberator or not.

    FACT: The audio tape supplied by the Phoenix Project that supposedly
    contains digital information is nothing more than a re-hashed
    self-help tape available to the general public.

    Here... you wanted a response, you got it. Now chew on this for awhile
    and tell me again that nothing that can legitimatly hoax the Phoenix
    Project has yet been introduced.

    (and I STILL want to hear the reasoning behind letting this report sit
    on a shelf for three years.)

    Joe.

    Jim Singleton
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jerry Woody@RICKSBBS to All on Monday, June 22, 2026 07:01:00
    Filename: Phoeni14.Thd
    Type : Message Thread
    Author : Jack Mathias
    Date : 11/28/92
    Desc : Rebuttal to Ed Stewart

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Re: Phoenix project From Ed Stewart To Joseph Harris 11-26-92 07:17

    -=> Quoting Joseph Harris to Jack Mathias <=-

    JH> (and I STILL want to hear the reasoning behind letting this report
    JH> sit on a shelf for three years.)

    ES> Believe me you don't want to hear it! ...but promised to provide me
    ES> with material later after they contacted their alleged "inside
    ES> experts within the Phoenix Group".

    ES> Sure enough two days later Jack Mathias downloaded a file directly
    ES> to me and suggested I could do with it what I wish with only one
    ES> consideration. Remove all references to the Phoenix Project if I
    ES> chose to make it public because of the "difficulties" they were
    ES> experiencing with Paranet.

    Ed...

    The way I remember it is that the file I downloaded to you was
    information on 1989FC and had nothing to do with the question
    referenced by Joseph. However the way I recall our meeting the question
    in point was answered. The reason that it took a couple of years for
    the report to be transmitted was because the Phoenix Project *had*
    never intended on submitting it. The only reason it was released was
    because I, myself, pestered the team in my belief that this information
    should be released -- that we should allow those interested in UFOs,
    etc, to perhaps gain more knowledge and insight. Which, as it now
    appears, turned out being bad judgement on my part.

    ES> After I analyzed the file contents I privately secured the
    ES> assistance and technical expertise of individuals in the Space
    ES> Program that I have access to through GENIE and found out that
    ES> their "reason for three year delay story" has more holes and
    ES> misinformation than what we have already been exposed to and is
    ES> simply utter nonsense.

    Your initial response to the file I gave you was -- as stated -- from
    information taken from GENIE and concerned 1989FC. I believe it was the
    idea that 1989FC never existed and that the probe currently on station
    mapping Venus was never diverted to track its course. It had nothing to
    do with any of the published reports. If the asteroid doesn't or didn't
    exist then the newspapers printed falsehood at the time. Making the
    article in last weeks [I believe] Newsweek also a falsehood since it
    referred to this.

    ES> Once misinformation becomes public, someone somewhere will always
    ES> chose to believe it.

    Believe it or not I go along with that thought. It is also true that
    once individuals or groups decide that a piece is filled with lies and
    loop-holes that have not been explained to *their* satisfaction and
    state such, this information is also retained by those reading it thus
    doing nothing but deepening the mystery, etc., and casting suspicious
    eyes at the group submitting the information.

    ES> But rest assure, if they ever answer your query (which I seriously
    ES> doubt they will ever do) and publicize the material they gave me as
    ES> the reason, I am prepared and WILL respond publicly to the
    ES> misinformation that is in the file contents. BTW, I am still
    ES> waiting for their answer on the F-4s on my query to them from over
    ES> two months ago.

    I have now received the files that Joseph has been nice enough to put
    into this echo for me and I must say that I found them interesting.
    However it is still my contention -- and that of the team -- that
    nothing has been disproved. I will say -- and I have mentioned this to
    Steve and Joseph on several occasions -- I am a bit disappointed that
    the *Team* chose not to respond to the files and they were made public.

    I, myself, am considering responding, in sorts, to Joesph in regards to
    his messages and also to the file released by Michael Corbin in which
    he addressed Don Kircher's 10/23/92 report because I still feel that
    something should be said. I do not believe for one instant that the
    book is closed. After all, unless one experiences something it will
    always remain hard for others who haven't, to believe.

    Sincerely, Jack Mathias


    Jerry
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jerry Woody@RICKSBBS to All on Monday, June 22, 2026 07:02:00
    Filename: Phoeni15.Thd
    Type : Thread
    Author : Joseph Harris
    Date : 11/29/92
    Desc : Rebuttal to Phoeni14.Thd/Phoeni14.Zip

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------


    -=> Quoting Jack Mathias to Ed Stewart <=-

    JM> The only reason it was released was because I, myself, pestered the

    JM> team in my belief that this information should be released -- that

    JM> we should allow those interested in UFOs, etc, to perhaps gain more

    JM> knowledge and insight. Which, as it now appears, turned out being

    JM> bad judgement on my part.


    Not bad judgement Jack, more like the report was ill-equipped to handle
    the kind of scrutiny we've put it through.

    JM> Believe it or not I go along with that thought. It is also true
    JM> that once individuals or groups decide that a piece is filled with
    JM> lies and loop-holes that have not been explained to *their*
    JM> satisfaction and state such, this information is also retained by
    JM> those reading it thus doing nothing but deepening the mystery,
    JM> etc., and casting suspicious eyes at the group submitting the
    JM> information.

    What else are we supposed to do Jack? In a field such as this,
    misinformation runs rampant. When we as independant investigators find
    flaws and loop-holes that do not get explained to our satisfaction, are
    we supposed to blindly accept whatever is told us? Do you want us to
    just accept the words of a here-to-for unknown group as gospel? Come on
    Jack, independant verification is the life-blood of all research. If
    one's findings can-NOT be independantly verified, then said findings
    MUST be viewed as inaccurate. So far, not ONE claim made in the K-2
    Report has been verified, other than static data. (ie the name of the
    mountain is Pilot Peak etc etc..)

    JM> I have now received the files that Joseph has been nice enough to

    JM> put into this echo for me and I must say that I found them

    JM> interesting. However it is still my contention -- and that of the

    JM> team -- that nothing has been disproved. I will say -- and I have

    JM> mentioned this to Steve and Joseph on several occasions -- I am a

    JM> bit disappointed that the *Team* chose not to respond to the files

    JM> and they were made public.

    Nothing has been disproved, that I'll grant you only on the grounds
    that I've not received confirming data on Pilot Peak. One of the key
    claims made in the K-2 Report involved the Magnetometer readings, and
    those are what I, and the SUFOG are working on now. However, too many
    of the statements made in the K-2 Report have been shown to be
    seriously flawed. This you cannot dispute.

    JM> I, myself, am considering responding, in sorts, to Joesph in

    JM> regards to his messages and also to the file released by Michael

    JM> Corbin in which he addressed Don Kircher's 10/23/92 report because

    JM> I still feel that something should be said. I do not believe for

    JM> one instant that the book is closed. After all, unless one

    JM> experiences something it will always remain hard for others who

    JM> haven't, to believe.

    If the Phoenix Project refuses to back-up, or at least attempt to
    explain some of the problems noted in the K-2 Report, then we must
    assume that these problems are such that they cannot BE explained,
    other than by admitting that the report is bogus. "Silence is an
    admission of guilt." That statement is upheld in most courts of law,
    and I believe it has relevance here. I look forward to hearing from
    you. Remember the key items we're interested in...

    1. The F-4's scrambling from a base that has never operated fighter
    aircraft of any type. How could this be "verified" ?

    2. The memo referancing a document that would not be received for 2
    more days.

    3. The lawyer attempting to incorporate the Phoenix Project who's
    office is the same as the mailing address of the Phoenix Liberator.

    These amongst many...

    Joe.

    Jerry
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
  • From Jerry Woody@RICKSBBS to All on Monday, June 22, 2026 07:02:00
    Filename: Phoeni16.Edi
    Type : Editorial/Opinion
    Author : Ed Stewart
    Date : 12/02/92
    Desc : Editorial on information sent by the Phoenix Project
    concerning the asteroid 1989FC to Steve Jones/Ed Stewart.


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study in Discernment

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 1 of 13


    I have been interested in the UFO phenomenon for over four decades.
    All but four months of it, as a reader of books, a dreamer of thoughts,
    a wonderer of what-ifs, and a debater of hypotheses. One day I saw a
    message on a local BBS about a trip being organized to the Pilot Peak
    area to search for a purported "underground UFO base".

    I wondered what-if and said why not? I met with the Sacramento UFO
    Group and together with Steve Jones and three days later with John
    Pickens from Fresno, I ventured to investigate. Steve Jones and John
    Pickens both have written trip reports on our quests. I didn't. Their
    concerns were mine and their reports related what probablly I would
    have said. We found nothing.

    In September, Steve Jones, Mike Mace and myself met with Jack
    Mathias, the spokesman and Richard Miller, a friend of the Phoenix
    Group, We met for four hours at the "Ormsby" in Carson City, Nevada. We
    chatted, traded expectations, and discussed our lack of findings over
    the K-2 Phoenix Report. We were aware of the Paranet warning over the
    Phoenix Group and I was particularly concerned over the question. Why
    Now? Why wait three years to release the reports? We received two
    different answers. Jack Mathias said he had proded the group to release
    the information and Richard Miller said he thought the Group was
    concerned over some possible events that might be occurring "soon". He
    said he thought it had something to do with a similar incident
    involving asteroid 1989FC. As an avid amateur astronomer since my early
    youth, my curiosity was peaked. He would not elaborate and said he
    would need permission from the Phoenix Group to release the
    information. If he received the Okay, he would have Jack get us a copy
    of their findings. A couple of days later the material was downloaded
    to me.

    We read it, checked it out, sought assistance from various sources.
    Bottom line, it was less verifiable than the original material. At the
    time, I felt It would have been a dis-service to the UFO community to
    release it. I felt it was that bad and I still do.

    Since then, through the efforts of many on this echo including
    members of the Sacramento UFO Group that physically visited the site,
    John Pickens report, Joseph Harris work, and Michael Corbin's initial
    warning much doubt was placed on the K-2 Report. When Don Kirschner's
    findings that the K-2 tape was bogus became public, Paranet declared
    the report a hoax.

    I decided to release this part of the investigation that deals with
    the question why release the reports now? But instead of just releasing
    Phoenix Project material on 1989FC whole with a warning message to take
    it with a grain of salt, I have dissected and inserted editorial
    comments along the way. Hopefuly people will see it for what it is and
    also hopefully people will be able pick up a pointer here and there and
    use it in their future research efforts.

    I don't consider myself the author of the commentary. I have over
    sixty pages of typewritten commentary on the original material from
    many, many sources that have contributed. I thank the various members
    of the Sacramento UFO Group that have contributed and e-mail
    correspondents on GENIE with special thanks to Art Bozlee and the other
    Science Round Table sysops that contributed, many of which were never
    aware of the original Phoenix Project material.

    Ed Stewart

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 1: Introductory Note and Header

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 2 of 13

    THE PHOENIX PROJECT

    PRIVILEGED INFORMATION

    09/13/92

    To: Steve Jones
    From: Staff 1, The Phoenix Project
    Subject: Asteroid 1989FC -- Information requested per conversation
    of 09/12/92 "Ormsby" meeting.

    Note: You will find this information useful. It will reveal additional
    insights in regard to our concern re the Alien intentions toward Earth
    and Humanity. Thank you for meeting with our representatives. Their
    evaluation of that contact was favorable. They requested this
    information be forwarded to you. You may use this data at your
    discretion.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Immediately we are faced with contradictions. The "Privileged
    Information" header accomplishes three goals:

    1. It asserts an air of officialness where as we shall see
    later, none should be asserted.

    2. Creates the idea that the information that follows is not
    easily obtained, or from classified sources.

    3. It becomes an ego boost for the readers by having an
    important piece of "Privileged Information" personally
    addressed to them.

    The last sentence nullifies the "Privileged Information" designation.
    As of this point, all information becomes public release. This is out
    of character for anyone with a background in intelligence. So right off
    the bat we know that "Staff 1" in all probability is not an
    intelligence operative or ever was.

    The "From: Staff 1 Phoenix Project:" header accomplishes the following:

    1. Polarization around a singular, mysterious and/or
    inaccessible leadership. Only select individuals may be
    granted access to this person known only as "Staff 1".

    2. But since the mysterious "Staff 1" has taken the reader into
    his confidence by making him privy to "Privileged"
    documentation and establishing the fact that the reader can
    be trusted, why then is this mysterious leader referring to
    himself as "Staff 1"?

    3. It is a psychological ego boost to have documentation
    addressed by the top authoritive figure of the group. Keep
    this in mind as we go through the documentation.

    The "Note:" paragraph accomplishes the following:

    1. "Thank you for meeting with our representatives."

    a. This reaffirms the inaccessibility of "Staff 1".

    b. This reaffirms the authority and rank of "Staff 1",
    thereby putting the reader in the subjective and
    subordinate posture.

    2. "Their evaluation of that contact was favorable."

    a. This is an ego boost...a pat in the back if you
    will.

    b. Also a subtle manipulation of the reader, but
    nonetheless a manipulation.

    c. The group has cracked the door open for the reader.
    They evaluated you and you have been found
    acceptable to them.

    3. "You may use this data at your own discretion."

    a. As stated above, a contradiction. Information is no
    longer privileged.

    b. This also makes "Privileged Information" nothing but
    a ploy or tease.

    c. The reader now has to decide as to whether or not to
    accept the mission. Even though none is specifically
    stated this introductory material has been carefully
    constructed to imply dissimination. What would you
    do with the information that follows? Would you
    immediately re-broadcast it throughout the echoes?

    d. The seduction has been set. The bait is in place.
    Will you be pulled in? Just nibble? Or ignore it?


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 2: The Initial "Privileged Information"

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 3 of 13

    YEAR: 1989
    DATE:
    CATEGORY: Launch & Mission Schedule
    TOPIC:
    SOURCE: NASA
    LOCATION:
    COMMENTS:

    1989 3/13/89 Discovery: KSC, STS-29, TDRS-4 & Photo Recon of Earth
    1989 4/29/89 Atlantis: KSC, STS-30, ABORT: Magellan Probe
    1989 5/4/89 Atlantis: KSC, STS-30, Launch: Magellan Venus Probe
    1989 5/20/89 DOD Launch, Vandenberg, Navigation Satellite
    1989 6/10/89 DOD Launch, KSC, Nav-Sat., Delta 2 Rocket
    1989 6/14/89 DOD Launch, KSC, Early Warning Sat., Thor Rocket
    1989 8/8/89 DOD Launch, KSC, Columbia: Spy Sat & SDI
    1989 8/14/89 DOD Launch, KSC, ABORTED: Delta-2 Rocket, Nav. Sat.
    1989 8/18/89 DOD Launch, KSC, The above 8/14/89 DOD Sat launched.
    1989 October Return of Asteroid 1989FC - Crossing Earth's orbit
    1989 October Atlantis: Galileo Probe to Jupiter
    1989 10/21/89 DOD Launch, KSC, Delta-1 Rocket, Navstar Sat.
    1989 November Comm Satellite Launch
    1990 Gamma Ray Observatory
    1990 Space Telescope
    1990 October - Sun Probe
    1992 Mars Observer Mission: The United States plans to
    send up an orbiting satellite
    in 1992, called the Mars
    Observer.

    NASA also is making tentative plans for a 1998 mission that would send
    a land rover to explore the planet for a year, collecting rock and soil
    samples. A spacecraft would return the samples to Earth.

    EOF

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    First of all, nothing is "Privileged" about the above information. It
    is simply a run of NASA launches that can be gotten by anyone that buys
    a paper, watches TV, has access to NASA-SELECT Cable, or uses a modem
    like you are right now to access one of the many echoes available to
    the public.

    A very subtle, even maybe subliminal manipulation of the reader
    though is attempted---blank categories up at the header information.
    "Necessary" informational categories have been left out. This is one of
    two things. It is either out of character and sloppy for someone,
    "Staff 1", that is supposed to have gleaned "Privileged Information"
    through unidentified field operatives from NASA, or it was purposely
    omitted thus making the "Privileged Information classification a
    "ploy", or "tease".

    Also, we have a very pertinent piece of information in the schedule
    missing: The discovery and original earth-orbit crossing of 1989 FC.
    Remember? That is why we are being fed all this privileged information.
    That date is important because later it will establish a major
    contradiction to the scenario presented by the "Phoenix Project".

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 3: What You Read Might Not Be What You See

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 4 of 14

    YEAR: 1989

    CATEGORY: Asteroid
    TOPIC: 1989FC
    SOURCE: New York Times, AP News Service - and others
    LOCATION: Earth
    COMMENTS: In cosmic terms, it was a close call. The object, named
    1989FC, presumed to be a large asteroid capable of wreaking
    widespread destruction in a collision with Earth passed
    within a half million miles of Earth, (a near-miss in cosmic
    terms) the closest approach of such an object in the last 50
    years.

    The asteroid, a collection of rock and dust half a mile or more in
    diameter, crossed Earth's orbit undetected March 23, in what is
    presumed to be one of its annual passes near Earth.

    It was discovered by Dr. Henry Holt, the Northern Arizona University
    astrogeologist and astronomer, in photographs taken March 31, using the
    18-inch Schmidt telescope at Mt. Palomar Observatory.

    Scientists later calculated that the asteroid, traveling at 46,000
    miles and hour, is orbiting the Sun once a year on an erratic
    elliptical path that brings it back every seven months toward Earth.

    "It can come this close or closer in the future. When two objects are
    in overlapping orbits, the bigger one inevitably pulls the smaller one
    into its path. Sooner or later it will collide with the Earth, the moon
    or Mars," said Dr. Holt.

    Dr. Brevan French, an advanced program scientist with NASA, said that
    if 1989FC collides with the Earth, the impact would be equivalent to
    the explosion of 20,000 one-megaton hydrogen bombs. A megaton is the
    explosive power of one million tons of TNT. French, NASA's expert on
    large space objects in the solar system, said that such an impact would
    dig a crater a mile deep and five to 10 miles wide. "Landing in an
    ocean would be even more destructive," he said. "Depending on the depth
    of the water, angle of entry and size, and speed, it could create tidal
    waves several hundred meters high. Waves that large could sweep over
    coastal areas, causing wide-spread destruction." If 1989FC hits the
    Earth, the odds are that it will hit an ocean.

    EOF

    July 1989 Follow Up Story -- Popular Science: July 1989, P13.

    Subsequent observations by Holt and other astronomers pegged the
    asteroids speed at 46,000 mph and determined its orbit is highly
    elliptical and erratic. It will cross Earth's orbit again in October
    1989, but at a greater distance than the 500,000 miles of its last
    encounter in March. This was the closest call of any Earth-crossing
    object since asteroid Hermes in 1937, which passed at about the same
    distance.

    Many scientists believe that periodic collisions with asteroids or
    comets have caused repeated mass extinctions on Earth, including one
    about 65 million years ago alleged to be responsible for the
    disappearance of the dinosaurs.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Again, we are provided with information that has been gleamed, this
    time from the NY Times and Popular Mechanics---nothing "Privileged"
    about it.

    On the surface it looks inocuous, but we are again manipulated,
    gently, subtly and maybe even subliminally. Notice the header date,
    3/23/89, the same date that the asteroid crossed Earth's orbit
    UNDETECTED. Obviously, it was not the date of the NY Times article.
    Also, notice that now we are also provided the "Privileged" information
    of the location of this source in the header: "Location: Earth"

    I point out these things because the reader's mind, subconsciously is
    picking all of this up, recording it and without the conscious mind
    awake, these subtle data points have no reference of true or false.
    This makes it easier for someone to convince the reader that the whole
    "scenario" makes sense and has validity. Be aware and pay attention to
    what you read and question it, before you accept the veracity of what
    is being told. Even in presenting a truth, someone with an agenda can
    manipulate a person's mind without them being aware unless you exercise
    critical analysis in your thinking.

    Also, ask why are these sources being presented? Why media sources
    and not the actual IAU circulars, or the scientist's press releases to
    the media? The media will edit, rewrite and sometimes leave out
    important information and sometimes even produce erroneous information.
    The NY Times article first tells us 1989FC makes a presumed pass every
    year. Two paragraphs later we are told once every seven months. So what
    is it then? Is the article reliable? Or was it just in a hurry to get
    to press? Does the Popular Mechanics article provide us with any new
    "Privileged" information? No. Its purpose here is to intensify the
    hype, placed here to manipulate the reader once again.

    Never take the media source for your prime source of information. Go
    to the actual source. Maybe what we are seeing here is the prime source
    for the "Phoenix Project", not the purported contacts they say they
    have within the intelligence community and inside "mysterious"
    government agencies.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 4: The Seduction Continues

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 5 of 13


    At this point, in the Phoenix Project file received, was a copy of an
    article that appeared in Flying Saucer Review:

    "The End Of A Chapter?"
    FSR (Vol.34, No.3, Sept., 1989)
    by FSR Editor Gordon Creighton

    Due to the lenght of the article I am omitting most of it and only
    including that part which deals with 1989FC. For those that might be
    interested in the full article, it is available as ASTEROID.ZIP at your
    favorite BBS across the country that have UFO related files. In essence
    the article discusses catastrophism and our fragile existence as
    related to the geological record.

    End of commentary

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    From "The End of A Chapter?" material from received Phoenix Project
    file:

    But now (Daily Telegraph, April 21, 1989) we learn that our Earth has
    just narrowly escaped being struck by a fresh, totally unknown,
    asteroid (1989FC) weighing some 400,000,000 tons, which passed within
    half-a-million miles of us in March of this year!

    Dr. Henry Holt, the Northern Arizona University astronomer who
    discovered this "beastie", using the Mount Palomar Optical Telescope,
    says that the thing had come in from the direction of the Sun, so that
    the Sun's glare had prevented anyone from detecting its approach
    sooner, and that, "If it had appeared only a few hours earlier, it
    would have nailed us."

    "Half-a-million miles from Earth" mean that, as it passed us, the
    size of the gap separating the asteroid from us was only twice the
    distance from the Earth to the Moon.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    By this time I am wondering what kind of hold that "Staff 1" has over
    Jack Mathias and Richard Miller? For Richard Miller to have to ask
    permission to release this kind of "Privileged" information? But most
    importantly, this article offers us a new piece of information that
    will in itself cast serious doubt on the scenario that the Phoenix
    Project will soon "reveal", the direction that 1989FC encountered
    earth's orbit.

    End of commentary

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    YEAR: 1989
    DATE: 4/29/89
    CATEGORY: Magellan Venus Probe
    TOPIC: Launch abort, Mission STS-30
    SOURCE: AP Wire
    LOCATION: KSC

    COMMENTS: The space shuttle Atlantis, which came within 31 seconds of
    liftoff Friday, could remain grounded until late next week,
    space officials said.

    Controllers scrubbed the launch when they detected an electrical
    surge in a main engine fuel pump. Launch director Bob Sieck said it
    will be at least Monday before a second launch can be tried, and he
    termed that timetable "optimistic" after saying NASA was also checking
    on an unexpected "vapor cloud" that emerged around a hydrogen fuel
    line.

    Note: Both of the above excuses were a cover story. The delay was
    needed to re-program Magellan's computers so it could track 1989FC when
    launched, and then continue on its Venus mission.

    NASA has a nice, long, launch window, until May 28 to get Magellan on
    its way. NASA personnel will inspect the Atlantis shuttle over the
    weekend. Liftoff could be delayed well into next week if the fuel pump
    or the fuel line has to be replaced.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    First we have a very not-so-subtle manipulation. A Note: inserted
    right in the middle of the AP story. Please note that it is not a
    "Staff 1 note" or a "Phoenix Project" note, but just a note. It is
    possible that a reader not paying attention, could mistake it for part
    of the AP story itself.

    But what of these claims the note makes? It is full of
    contradictions. First of all, there was no need to delay a launch to
    re-program Magellan's Computers. If "Staff 1" had simple access to
    NASA-SELECT Cable TV or if any of the Phoenix Project "Operatives"
    lightly followed NASA projects, they would know that Magellan's onboard
    computers could be easily programmed remotely whether on the ground or
    in flight.

    Also, notice that the launch was stopped 31 seconds before liftoff.
    This is April 29, 1989. Knowledge of 1989FC was known to science at
    least since the release of IAU Circular 4767 dated April 7, 1989 so we
    know that the actual discovery was made before April 7. But without any
    substantiation at all "Staff 1" wants us to believe that NASA would
    risk a one billion dollar project almost down to the wire, 31 seconds
    before lift-off to "reprogram" its computers---when it had the
    knowledge of 1989FCs existence and the time to do it for almost an
    entire month.

    Also, remember that all this time that Magellan is on the ground,
    1989FC is zip-a-doing away at the speed of 46,000 miles an hour away
    from Magellan and the Earth going in the other direction---making the
    task of tracking it that much difficult if it could even do it. Well,
    we already suspected that "Staff 1" had very little knowledge or
    experience as an intelligence operative, now it appears that "Staff 1"
    also has very little knowledge of NASA operations, capabilities and
    programs.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 5: "Staff 1's" Resume Gathers Points

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 6 of 13

    YEAR: 1989
    DATE: 4/28/89
    CATEGORY: Magellan Venus Probe
    TOPIC: Shuttle Atlantis, Mission STS-30
    SOURCE: AP Wire
    LOCATION: KSC
    COMMENTS: Lennard Fisk, NASA's chief scientist, said the launch of the
    explorer craft Magellan will mark "a resurgence of America's
    planetary program." The last American probe sent to deep
    space was the Pioneer-Venus dispatched in 1978. Magellan is
    to be released from Atlantis' cargo bay six hours after
    launch and sent streaking on a 15-month, 806-million mile
    trip of its own. Magellan will be carrying some of the most
    sophisticated remote mapping sensors ever sent to another
    planet. An imaging radar system will be able to detect
    features on the surface as small as 100 yards, about the size
    of a football field. The radar will be operated during almost
    2,000 passes over the Venusian surface, each time viewing a
    slice of the planet and then sending the images back to Earth
    for computer enhancements. Magellan is expected to map about
    90 percent of the surface while orbiting Venus for about 243
    Earth days, equal to a single Venus day.

    EOF

    YEAR: 1989
    DATE: 5/6/89
    CATEGORY: Magellan Venus Probe
    TOPIC: Shuttle Atlantis, Mission STS-30
    SOURCE: AP Wire
    LOCATION: KSC
    COMMENTS: Follow on story:

    The 7600-pound Magellan probe launched late Thursday, was more than
    175,000 miles from the shuttle Atlantis by late Friday afternoon. Its
    initial speed of 25,000 mph has slowed gradually to a cruising speed of
    about 7,000 mph. As it nears its target in August 1990 the tug of the
    Venusian gravity will increase its speed to 25,000 mph again.

    NASA reported the Magellan was off course by a small amount, but this
    was not unexpected. On May 21, a ground station will send a signal to
    trigger a small motor firing to adjust the course.

    Note: It was "off course" because Magellan and its sophisticated radar
    capability was tracking 1989FC, in an attempt to determine its exact
    orbit so its return and possible collision with Earth could be
    predicted.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    For those of you that follow NASA, you know that NASA issues daily
    reports and updates on all ongoing NASA projects. Here we have two hand
    picked reports 8 days apart. A warning bell should go off. Why these
    two reports and not others?

    Again, we have a very subtle deception in the above two pieces of
    "Privileged" information provided by "Staff 1". The first AP wire
    addresses the capabilities of the onboard Magellan computers and it
    certainly appears that they are capable of tremendous feats and that
    they are, manipulating the reader into believing that they can do
    anything. But there is one exception. They only work on Venus. The
    sensor, mapping and radar devices on Magellan were designed and
    calibrated to be used only on Venus and only a limited range of orbital
    altitutes were available for collection of mapping data. For Magellan
    to work and do its job, it had to be in close proximity to Venus. For
    the most part, this wonderful computer equipment had to wait until
    Magellan achieved a Venus orbit.

    In the 2nd AP wire story again we have the intrusion of the non-
    identity "note". But what about its claim? Do you recall the date of
    its closest approach to earth orbit? March 23, 1989. For 43 days now,
    1989 FC has been streaking away from us at 46,000 miles per hour. By
    this time, it isn't even close anymore or for that matter, in the same
    part of the Solar System as Earth or Magellan. The "Phoenix Project
    operatives" and "Staff 1" also forget that Magellan slowed down to
    7,000 mph. Each hour that goes by, 1989FC is getting further and
    further away making its tracking (if it was so) that more difficult if
    not impossible.

    Now wait a minute? What about the off-course claim? Yes, it was off
    course. But what "Staff 1" didn't know is that the booster used, the
    IUS, is solid fueled. With solid fuel you can not test the motor
    beforehand. Thus it isn't uncommon to have to tweak the trajectory to
    compensate for these slight variations. The total delta vee (an
    engineers shorthand way of saying the change of velocity) of the tweak
    was only a few feet per second, a very small value indeed. Which kind
    of puts the damper on "Staff 1" and the whole "off exploring the
    asteroid" caper.

    Again, it appears that the only things that "Staff 1" and the
    "Phoenix Project operatives" really know and understand about NASA
    operations, comes from a cursory look at what the AP wire puts out.
    Which leads me to wonder, if the information they say they have access
    to is not coming from the "inside", where is it coming from?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 6: "Staff 1" Re-asserts Himself

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 7 of 13


    YEAR: 1989
    DATE: 4/26/89
    CATEGORY: Project Zeus - SDI
    TOPIC: Magellan Probe - Shuttle Atlantis, Mission STS-30
    SOURCE: AP Wire: Cape Canaveral, FL.
    LOCATION: KSC

    COMMENTS: The Atlantis commander says his crew is "mighty proud" to be
    part of the first space shuttle planetary mission scheduled
    to blast- off this Friday. The countdown, which started
    Tuesday, continued toward a liftoff at 2:24 p.m. Friday.

    Six hours after launch, astronauts Mark Lee and Mary Cleave are to
    release the 7,600-pound Magellan probe and a rocket to propel it on a
    468-day journey to Venus.

    Magellan is to reach its destination in August 1990, swooping into
    orbit around Venus to begin a 243-day period during which it is to map
    up to 90 percent of the cloud-shrouded planet's surface with the
    probe's high resolution radar system.

    "We're not really in charge of the deep space probe," said Commander
    David Walker. "We're fortunate enough to be part of the team that gets
    to send it up there. The rest of the NASA team will make sure that it
    gets to Venus and does its job."

    UPDATE: NASA, KSC Release # 24-89, March 1989

    Magellan marks the first U.S. planetary mission since Pioneer Venus
    12 in 1978. It also kicks off a core program of solar system
    exploration involving NASA and organizations from the United States and
    the international community.

    Project Zeus: One of the payload experiments includes the Mesoscale
    Lighting Experiment, a NASA sponsored effort involving several
    universities. Its objective is to study the visual characteristics of
    large scale lighting in the upper atmosphere. (part of the Project Zeus
    effort to study laser beam diffusion in the upper atmosphere).

    In addition, as another experiment, "The Shuttle Atlantis will act as
    a calibration point for a third experiment involving the Air Force Maui
    Optical System Facility in Hawaii."

    Phoenix Project Note: Project Zeus - SDI Experiment. Although
    unstated in this NASA Release, Atlantis is acting as an orbital mirror
    being tracked by the Air Force facility (SDI ground based laser
    facility) named in the above paragraph.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Here now for the first time we see "Phoenix Project Note", no longer
    "Note", no more need to pussy foot around, time to reaffirm(see
    commentary in Part 1). Ask yourself if your heart didn't pump a little
    bit faster when you read "Phoenix Project Note"? Why did it? Because
    even though you are being walked through this, your subconscious is
    reacting to the manipulative techniques exposed so far.

    We went from the initial strong manipulative Introduction which
    established the subordinate/authority relation between the reader and
    "Staff 1", through a series of non-identity notes and now we are coming
    back where the authority is once again emerging.

    But what about the Phoenix Project Note? What does it really mean?

    1. "Staff 1" alludes that he is providing us with "Privileged
    Information", hidden knowledge that NASA is not telling the
    reader.

    2. Also he introduces a new player in the game---SDI experiment.

    3. "Staff 1" has raised the stakes! Another sinister element.


    But, is it really sinister? Is NASA not telling us something? Do we
    really have a new player in the game?

    First of all, the source we are being quoted is once again an AP
    wire. Doesn't "Staff 1" know that NASA releases detailed mission
    profiles on shuttle missions? Available to anyone that wants one. And
    if it indeed does have a classified DOD mission, it says so. This
    ladies and gentlemen, is a classified DOD mission or experiment. Each
    shuttle mission carries an array of experiments and projects. The
    shuttle is often used as a tracking target for a number of earth and
    space based photo recon and optical tracking systems as its orbit is
    VERY WELL known, and the optical characteristics of the spacecraft are
    well understood. Thus many systems use it as a passive target test.
    Nothing sinister here.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 7: And Now For The Rest Of The Story
    The footnotes will be addressed later

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 8 of 13


    Note: The following data was provided The Phoenix Project by
    (concerned) sources within the U.S. Intelligence community. See
    comments in numbered footnotes.

    Year: 1990
    To: The Phoenix Project
    Excerpt:

    ...Start:

    a) "The Greys are actively engaged in a wide variety of attention
    diverting operations on a world-wide scale. Their operations are
    to delay the SDI program, and human counter-measures against
    them.(1) The operations are designed to re-direct and drain
    humanities resources in futile attempts to deal with an endless
    series of new, urgent, and continually developing problems.

    "Serious events will occur with overwhelming regularity with a
    projected peak in the latter half of 1992.(2) The problems
    confronting all humanity are rapidly reaching the saturation
    level. Their enormous quantity threatening to "overload"
    humanities ability to deal with them.(3) The inevitable result
    when this occurs, will be the collapse of civilized society -- a
    prime objective of the Greys.

    "Humanity is directly responsible for the greatest number of their
    overwhelming problems -- for all the reasons intelligent men have
    warned about. The Greys are using human greed, ambition and
    weakness, and lust for power, against humanity. This is an
    indication of "their" intelligence."

    b) "The alien beings from Zeta Reticulum (the Greys) have become
    aware that the U.S. and USSR are deploying a major weapons system
    for use against them. (The SDI, Star Wars system).

    "With the resumption of NASA's Shuttle Program, on September 29,
    1988, after the lengthy delay caused by the "Challenger" disaster,
    the U.S. has made a frantic effort to launch secret SDI payloads
    into orbit. This increased activity has alarmed the Greys.

    "The Greys, know it is only a matter of time before SDI (Star
    Wars) becomes fully operational and can be used against them.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Please note the added quotes, yet not one direct source cited. Also,
    this alleged information is provided by not just intelligence members,
    but "concerned" intelligence members. The quotes provide a subtle
    accent of authenticity where none exists. By differentiating and
    stating "concerned", "Staff 1" implies division within the ranks of
    intelligence. The good guys vrs. the bad guys. The good guys like
    "Staff 1" and his group the Phoenix Project. Somewhere along the line
    the "good intelligence guys" feel that "Staff 1" is somehow empowered
    to do something about this.

    But wait a minute! Why are they giving "Staff 1" the lowdown? If they
    are really "concerned", wouldn't they give this information to someone
    that could really take care of the "threat"? Not some obscure group no
    one ever heard of before? Could it be that "Staff 1" is somekind of
    powerhouse in disguise? We know he does not have a background in
    intelligence. We know he doesn't know anything about NASA. What is it
    that the "good intelligence guys" know that we don't?

    But what is it that "Staff 1" is really saying here?

    1. That the grays are going to kick our ass.
    2. That the world is going to come to an end.
    3. That we are on the verge of not having a leader.
    4. That it is our own fault.
    5. That the grays know us real well and our human weaknesses.
    6. And therefore the grays are "really" smart.
    7. But wait! The grays have a fear. SDI

    But if the grays are "really" smart, capable of travelling all the
    way here from Zeta Reticuli, using technologies hundreds if not
    thousands of years ahead of us that we have no clues about, and not
    giving a hoot about all the nuclear armaments stockpiled & deployed
    over forty-five years, why would they fear something that is no more
    than a SMART SPEAR? Now, I am no Columbo. I really need some help on
    this one folks.

    But so far all we have seen is subtle posturing and manipulation
    coupled with doses of hysteria and paranoia with the hint that "Staff
    1" might be some real "powerhouse" capable of taking us under his wing.
    Never mind that so far everything he has told us simply doesn't check
    out. That is not the point. The point is that there is no one else
    around. Now, I am no Columbo, but it seems to me that just maybe this
    "Staff 1" needs to be given a second look.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 8: There is help on the way

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 9 of 13


    Note: The following data is known by MAJI and a select few in the
    Intelligence Community.

    Re: The Greys

    "To delay the SDI effort the Greys conceived a masterful plan. A plan
    to create the greatest delay possible. A delay that would insure their
    development of a counter weapon and also allow them to gain greater
    control over human society.

    "Their plan was to create a major catastrophe, seemingly natural in
    occurrence, which would require the full attention and resources of
    humanity to cope with. A diversionary tactic so vast, in scope, that
    the U.S. and USSR would have little time or the resources to deploy
    SDI.
    "This was their plan:

    "In early 1989, two of the Grey's spacecraft entered the Asteroid
    Belt between Mars and Jupiter. There, they selected an asteroid (later
    named 1989FC) over a half-mile in diameter. They nudged this asteroid
    into position. Then, sent it hurtling on a collision course with Earth.

    "Their well-planned catastrophe would occur when it struck the Earth
    several months later. World governments would, then, divert their
    efforts to the immediate tragic events. The Greys would gain the
    additional delay they needed.

    "The nature and consequences of this remarkable and deadly event, are
    evidence that the Grey's feel seriously threatened by the SDI Weapons
    System and that they are capable of creating widespread destruction.
    The death of thousands of humans is of little consequence to them. They
    are determined to subjugate the Earth and enslave human society. Any
    act needed to accomplish this is acceptable to them.

    "The Greys are still wondering why their asteroid (1989FC) missed the
    Earth. They are unaware that it was diverted by (name deleted)."(4)

    End of Excerpt

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Excuse me one moment "Staff 1". Did you say they nudged it into place
    and then sent it hurtling towards Earth? I am sorry. I knew I
    misunderstood. MAJI and select few within the intelligence community
    said that. That makes me feel much, much better. I have seen Mighty
    Mouse do that on Saturday Mornings.

    But you see, "Staff 1", there is something that you forgot about
    while you were trying to catch up on how intelligence operatives and
    NASA operations work. It is called orbital mechanics. To change the
    orbit of an object you have to consult Isaac Newton first. I also
    suspect that a spacefaring race like the grays, would also know all
    about orbital mechanics. Point and shove simply doesn't wash at all.
    Also, if I recall from the earlier factual AP wires you were so kind to
    provide me. Asteroid 1989FC approached Earth's orbit from the direction
    of the Sun. I know that is just a minor technicality but maybe it is
    worth noting.

    I am sorry. I didn't hear you. You say to read the last paragraph of
    the MAJI posting? (name deleted) diverted 1989FC? And the grays are
    scratching their heads? Trying to figure out what went wrong?

    But, now I am really confused. Didn't you just tell us that the grays
    were really "smart"? There is someone smarter? (name deleted) is
    smarter. And the grays with all their might, don't have a clue as to
    who (name deleted) is? But MAJI and a few select members of the
    intelligence community know who (name deleted) is. I assume that
    you,"Staff 1", also knows who (name deleted) is?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 9: Is Their a case of footpowder in the Echo-PLEASE?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 10 of 13


    FOOTNOTES:

    1. The Shuttle Challenger disaster. Grey directed sabotage -- to delay
    the deployment of the SDI weapons system by halting the space
    program. A two year delay was accomplished. This sabotage was
    revealed in the U.S. Senate Investigation of the Challenger Shuttle
    disaster. Expert testimony, revealed in the Senate investigation,
    disclosed the presence of tiny "knife-like" cuts in the rubber "O"
    Rings between booster sections. This damaging testimony was openly
    revealed in the televised Senate hearing. However, the source of the
    sabotage was not revealed and the subject was quickly changed.

    MAJI determined the sabotage was carried out by an inspector at
    Morton- Thiokol's Utah plant and by a contractor's worker at Kennedy
    Space Center. MAJI investigators, later, apprehended both
    individuals. Examination and interrogation revealed that both had
    "implants" and were under the Grey's mental control. Both men have
    disappeared from public view.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    I used to work on the STS program as well as Art Bozlee, the
    Aerospace Science SYSOPS on Genie where most of this information comes
    from. If the Challenger accident was an act of sabotage why are there
    NO records of the committee meetings? Even secret testimony has a
    public date. The dates are a matter of public record. Only the records
    would be secret. The fact the Senate met to investigate Challenger
    would be in the public record. All the meetings are known, and the
    record is in the public domain through the Congressional Record. There
    was no secret testimony. None. Zero. Zip. Nada.

    There were cuts in some of the SRB O-rings caused by hot gas erosion
    that look much like they were made with a blade, but they are the
    result of the lousy design of the system and the fact the cuts only
    showed up when the rings were cold. If the O-rings got cold and they
    were flexed as they would be when the Shuttle SRBs ignite the brittle
    O-ring material literally cracks with a hard, clean edge that looks to
    the naked eye as if it were made with a knife.

    Electron microscopy shows a quite different picture on the very small
    scale, thus we can tell if the O-ring was cut or was broken. The
    Challenger 0-rings were broken. There is no evidence that suggests,
    even for a milisecond, that sabotage was a factor in the accident. And
    yes, that aspect of it was investigated quite completely.

    Apparently what MAJI also doesn't know is that the O-rings are
    installed in Florida, not Utah. An inspector in Utah could not have
    done the deed if he wanted to.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    2. The recent "catastrophic" weather events (examples of the Grey's
    technological prowess) i.e., the two recent Hurricanes devastating
    Florida, Louisiana, and Hawaii. In addition, consider the recent
    diversionary and attention demanding events in Germany, the USSR,
    Yugoslavia, the Persian Gulf and Somalia. The Grey's timetable is on
    schedule. The number of controlled Humans exceeds one third of the
    Earth's population, based on current intelligence estimates. With
    this number of pawns, under their control, they can create
    diversions where ever they choose.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Excuse me "Staff-1", if what you say is true and the grays are in
    such control, why would they have to skip-a-doo to the barrios between
    Mars and Jupiter to nudge a rock our way that would only create a
    crater 10 miles wide? And whose current intelligence estimates? It
    wouldn't be MAJI by any chance, the same folks that don't know that O-
    rings are installed in Florida, not Utah?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    3. Current relief efforts are being strained to existing limits.
    "Overload," is close at hand. The monetary expense to pay for same,
    could soon bankrupt the U.S. and the world economic community.
    Should one or more additional major disasters occur before the end
    of 1992 i.e., a major earthquake, 7.5 or greater, in a heavily
    populated area, another devastating hurricane, an asteroid strike,
    etc., economic and social collapse is foreseen. The Greys will have
    achieved their objectives.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Did everyone pay close attention as to when "Staff-1" discourse
    turned from an appearance of presenting verifiable facts to wantom
    hysteria and paranoia? Did everyone notice a steady declining rate from
    the rational to the irrational?

    Staff-1? Who is doing the foreseeing? So far you have demonstrated a
    lack of knowledge of intelligence procedures, NASA operations, orbital
    mechanics, and you have an association with a group of people, MAJI,
    that purports to have investigated the Challenger disaster, but
    obviously doesn't even know where the O-rings were installed.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 10: Hey! Where is the beef?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 11 of 13


    4. MAJI, elements of the Intelligence Community, and the Phoenix
    Project, know that there are "other" extraterrestrials adamantly
    opposed to the Grey's plans. On occasion, these "others" have
    quietly interfered with certain of the Grey's operations. Thus far,
    the Greys are unaware that they have experienced such interference.
    The diversion of 1989FC is an example.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    We now see that we have a whole team in the huddle, a triad, that
    together are smarter than the grays. "Staff-1", you have me confused
    again. First you say the grays are smart, then you say they are not
    smart, then you say they are powerful, then you say they are not that
    powerful, then you say they are all powerful, and now we find out that
    they don't even know of these "others" that are spoiling their
    takeover, even though just a while back you emphatically suggest that
    they could do it anytime they so wished. Is it that they have been
    spending too much time out between Mars and Jupiter moving rocks
    around?

    You say the grays can hop on two spacecraft, position an asteroid and
    hurl it towards Earth, that they control the weather on Earth, and one
    third of the population, yet not see someone tip-toe in their own turf
    and reposition the asteroid? I am really impressed. I have never seen
    Mighty Mouse do that. Who are these "others"?

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    MAJI is fully aware of the Greys intentions. They have undertaken
    many covert operations against the Greys, without their knowledge,
    while maintaining a pretence of cooperation with them --still hoping
    they will obtain the Grey's technology. This dangerous charade has
    created a dissident element within MAJI that is "leaking"
    information to sympathetic and concerned individuals in the
    Intelligence Community.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Whoo now! You mean that not only the "others" but also MAJI tip-toes
    behind the grays without the grays knowing? And still play poker with
    them? A while back, I thought you said that MAJI couldn't handle the
    grays at all. So it isn't MAJI that leaks information to you, but the
    dissident MAJI. What is it? They don't know how to play poker? Which
    MAJI group investigated the shuttle disaster? I want to know who not to
    stack my chips behind.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    MAJI, to "hedge their gamble," is also trying to establish a liaison
    with those "other" extraterrestrials, in the hopes that "they" will
    "bail-them-out" if the Greys come too close to achieving their
    ultimate objectives. This duplicity has not gone un-noticed by the
    "others." To date, MAJI has not achieved any success in this
    endeavor.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    These "others" sound like the ones I would want to bet on. Everybody
    else you have introduced me to seems to be loosing it somewhere along
    the way. Who are these "others"? I called Jack right after I first read
    these files and he wouldn't give me a direct answer. He did say though
    that if I read the prologue to Starwards, all my questions would be
    answered. The prologue would introduce me to the "others". But there
    was nothing in there that said "The 'others' are______." It was just
    one of your operatives, Richard Miller talking about Hatoon, the real
    Hatoon.

    Staff-1, just between you and I, we both know that the contactee
    scene of the fifties through seventies has for the most part fell out
    of favor with the UFO community. You don't suppose Richard Miller might
    be trying a comeback of somekind? Do you? You know. Something more
    palatable to the hopla that has taken investigators away from the real
    phenomena and stopped investigating sightings associated with physical
    trace evidence on the hope that somebody with the inside stuff would
    line their pockets. Something with more of a 80s-90s flavor. Something
    that... Naa, sorry. It was just a silly thought.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 11: Not Quite the End

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 12 of 13


    In Summary:

    The Phoenix Project realizes that the foregoing has a strong
    resemblance to something that might have been created by Milton W.
    (Bill) Cooper. We regret any resemblance to such (Cooper sounding)
    sensational material and can assure you that it is not based on any
    Cooper material we are aware of. Cooper did not supply any of this
    information or have anything to do with our research or evaluation
    concerning it.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    Thank you for the qualifier. "Staff-1", when you do become aware of
    whose material it is, I hope you will let us know. I am sure Cooper is
    happy not to be associated with you either.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Our only purpose in providing this material is to clarify a major
    reason for our concern -- regarding past, current and world-wide
    events, what we know concerning those events, and how those events
    are being orchestrated by the Greys. Another purpose, is to alert
    researchers to the presence of additional information, make it
    available to them for further research, and provide another insight
    into what is happening. It is not our intent to present this
    material for sensational purposes, gain recognition, or create
    public panic.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    "Staff-1", your ONLY purpose counted out to six purposes. Maybe after
    you finish your refresher courses in basic intelligence, NASA
    operations, orbital mechanics, the Challenger disaster, and proper tape
    recording techniques, you might wish to refresh yourself in basic math.

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    The information is factual in our opinion with sources quoted,
    whenever possible, so its content can be validated. What you do with
    it, is up to you. However, we request that you use discernment if it
    is to receive further dissemination.

    Staff-1
    The Phoenix Project

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Commentary edited by Ed Stewart

    "Staff-1", a suggestion if I may? Less quotes, more and better
    sources.

    And what do we have here? "USE DISCERNMENT...". "Staff-1", a piece of
    advice that everyone on this echo should take to heart and practice,
    practice, practice. "Staff-1", you have made a worth-while
    contribution. I thank you.


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Part 12: Concluding Remarks---A Case Study in Discerment

    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    A Case Study Page 13 of 13


    I hold that the UFO phenomenon is real, physical, interacts with the
    environment and as a corollary, humanity on a global scale. I also hold
    that no one today knows what the UFO phenomenon is all about. I know I
    don't.

    It appears to me that the best way to help unravel the UFO phenomenon
    is by investigating and analysing those sighting cases that have
    physical trace evidence associated with it in the hopes that new clues
    can be turned into information that will give us a better understanding
    of what the UFO phenomenon is all about.

    One thing that is clear, to me at least, is that for the last few
    years UFO researchers have been chasing "windmills" on the advice of
    "former intelligence officers", "unknown sources that can't be quoted",
    "members of unknown, mystical government agencies" and people
    (sometimes associated with cults) that profess to have one or more of
    "these inside sources". Please! Ask yourselves a simple question. What
    more do we REALLY know about the phenomenon today, than we did five
    years ago? or ten?

    When I ask that of myself, the answer comes back with a resounding
    NOTHING. Another thing that is apparent to me is that all the time UFO
    researchers have invested on the advice of these "mystical moles" is
    time that has not been used to verify, investigate and analyse UFO
    cases and reports that have physical trace EVIDENCE associated with
    them. Resources available to the UFO community are scarce at very best.
    If you consider yourself as a resource, invest it wisely, use
    DISCERNMENT and above all CRITICAL THINKING. You can't waste
    discernment or critical analysis, but you can sure waste your time.

    A common fallacy in reasoning is mistaking losses for investment. We
    all do it. A typical example is the lottery player, maybe your next
    door neighbor, maybe you, that views all the money spent previously on
    lottery tickets as an investment and that that somehow will increase
    the chances on the next lottery ticket purchased. A loss is not an
    investment. A loss of time is not an investment. Losing time on a hoax,
    misinformation, or disinformation is not an investment on coming closer
    to REAL ANSWERS to the UFO phenomenon.

    To paraphrase something that "Staff-1" said and change it slightly:

    Some people are using human greed, ambition and weakness, and
    lust for power against UFO researchers (and the UFO community).
    This is an indication of their intelligence.

    You and I want REAL ANSWERS. We are starving for real answers with
    substance. We are lusting for real clues. We have an ambition, the
    ambition to discover what the UFO phenomenon is all about. Don't let it
    become our weakness. Use discernment and critical thinking---our two
    best allies. Don't let some people con us out of our time---a resource
    we will never be able to replace. If your serious about real answers to
    the UFO phenomenon, as soon as you discover misinformation,
    disinformation, or hoaxes, call it for what it is---A LOSS. Not an
    investment. And take your resources---discernment, critical thinking,
    and time---and invest them productively, not with the same people that
    you already know will produce losses for you.

    Ed Stewart

    Jerry
    telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23
    http://ricksbbs.synchro.net:8080
    ---
    þ Synchronet þ Rick's BBS telnet://ricksbbs.synchro.net:23